Trapshooters Forum banner

1 - 20 of 27 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
766 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Let's see what is really going on inside a loaded shell.
I posted some pictures of finished loads for some one ounce loads and some 7/8 loads that seemed to open a can of worms. The loads were using book data from Hodgdon. The only zinger, not the Dolly Madison kind, is that I showed the loads inside a translucent Remington Clay and Field hull.
My OPINION and I would like to hear from others, some wads are more forgiving than others, and are EASIER to load with, and require less adjustment of the press.
I use Remington TGT and Fig8 (Clones included) wads a great deal of the time. They seems to crimp better in my component selection. My OPINION is they crush easier than WAA12 style wads resulting in a better finish crimp more often.
I find AA wads need to be adjusted more and I end up with dished crimps more often than I do with Rem style wads.
I normally load Remington hulls and Federal Gold Medal hulls. I do not use AA hulls. This very well could be the basis of my bias.

Here are some of the pictures previously posted.
one ounce load with a TGTwad
7/8 load with a DRXXL1 Pink wad

Feel free to blast me provide you own opinions.

Over the next couple of days, I will load up several different loads using the translucent Clay and Field hulls. That way we can see what is going on inside and maybe get a better look at what is really going on. I will use my 9000G to size, deprime, and prime as well a starter crimp, finish crimp, and taper the shells. I will use my 600JR for inserting wads at zero pressure. I will hand weigh each shot and powder charge. I have a three day weekend, gotta do something.
One ounce wads will be OEM TGT12, DR Hybrid TGT, and WAASL. I will load some 1 1/8 ounce just for fun. I have a few different wads.
DR Jammer Orange, DR Blue Duster, possibly some DR Hybrid Fig8
Clays of the newer variety, purchased two months ago, will be used. One ounce loads will be loaded to 1235 fps and the 1 1/8 ounce will be loaded to 1145 fps. Exact data used will be posted.

Let's see how they look.

If anyone else has some translucent hulls, Remington or others, please load some up and show us what you got.

More to follow.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
3,132 Posts
My OPINION and I would like to hear from others, some wads are more forgiving than others, and are EASIER to load with, and require less adjustment of the press.
What the heck - I'll play... I pretty much only adjust my press when switching to different kinds of hulls, not for different wads.

If anyone else has some translucent hulls, Remington or others, please load some up and show us what you got.
Pretty sure I haven't shot 'em all up yet. I'll look & hopefully the boxes are marked with the load... stay tuned lol
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
3,132 Posts
My OPINION is they crush easier than WAA12 style wads resulting in a better finish crimp more often.
Oh yea, I was under the impression that the crush section was supposed to 'give' upon powder detonation - not so much while loading ???
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
3,132 Posts
Well, I did find a 100 count box of 'first shot for doubles' loads that I brewed up a while back... They kicked quite a bit and have since went with 1oz for the first shot...
These are 9/8 of #8 1/2s with 17.7gr Red Dot and a WT-12 wad
 

Attachments

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
8,269 Posts
Well, I did find a 100 count box of 'first shot for doubles' loads that I brewed up a while back... They kicked quite a bit and have since went with 1oz for the first shot...
These are 9/8 of #8 1/2s with 17.7gr Red Dot and a WT-12 wad
Phatkaw,
May I ask why so much poweder?
Your 1 1/8th oz load is a pleasure to shoot at 17.0 gr of Red Dot.
Duplicates the factory AA Light 1145 fps shell. There is no need for 10% more powder in your load. Not for singles or either shot in doubles.
Give it a whirl,
MG
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
5,724 Posts
phatkaw: A+ on the stack height.

And, I'll bet those 9/8 oz loads are going faster than you think they are. I agree with mg1polo, knock 'em back a click or two.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
3,132 Posts
MG and Nebs, like I said above "they kicked quite a bit" and now I'm shootin' 1oz ers a lot more...

I shot and reloaded a bazillion shells over the winter and actually I have the 28ga to thank for realizing that I don't need Super Handicaps to break targets!

^^^ Those loads would be great for long yardage HDCP if I had 7 1/2s in them instead... lol
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
766 Posts
Discussion Starter #9
My apologies guys, I did not get my homework done this weekend. I made a deal with the devil. I have a new pup on the way. It cost me all new flooring on the main level, painting four rooms on the main level, and new counter tops. I had to get a head start this weekend, since I will be providing the labor for the majority of the work. Sounds like some of the deals made for new trap guns. Anyway, I will load up the shells and post pictures as soon as I can.

Break em all.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
14,805 Posts
I load the DR fig8 clone with Red Dot or Promo in the STS and it seams to shoot softer (at least that's the way it feels to me) than the WT12 wad. The original WT12 wad was a stiffer/cheaper concoction of plastic than the OEM WAA12 wad. Not sure if that is the case anymore, but if you look at some of the Red Dot loads, the pressure changes when a WT12 wad is used in lieu of a AA12 wad. More the case with AAHS hulls than STS,

I would agree that the load is probably faster than you think.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
830 Posts
I don't really have any idea what you're talking about when you say " crush easier ". I'm not trying to be rude BUT, as phatkaw said, the wad isn't suppose to crush when you're reloading but when the shell goes off. Why on earth would you weigh every load and use a different press to insert the wad ? I buy wads by the case for better prices. I've never noticed a difference between wads when reloading, with my 9000H, or pulling a handle on a JR. And, I never "crush " a wad when loading. Just seat the wad on the powder about all that's necessary. Sorry if I am blasting you, but you ask for it. I just don't have any understanding of what or why you're doing what you are. :018:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,433 Posts
Maybe he used Lange Uniwads at some point in reloading. They said to crush the wad legs to fit your load.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
766 Posts
Discussion Starter #13 (Edited)
Hull 06.jpg
The wad is being compressed on the final crimp stage. Crushed may not be the best term used. When the wads are inserted there is no wad pressure being applied on a 9000G or a MEC Jr.
Until I looked at the shells loaded in a Clay and Field hull, I had no idea what was happening inside the hull. Book loads using listed components.
No worries on getting "Blasted". I was aware of what the thread could turn into when I started it.
Here are some of the Clay and Field pictures again. Not sure where they went to.
The 7/8 wad is crushed, and that is by design, DRXXL-Pink, The other is a OEM TGT12 and it is compressed a bit.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
830 Posts
I believe the design of the wad allows for small differences in loads. Different powders take up more or less room, different bushings allow a little more ore less shoot to drop. And then different pressures being put on the wad when dropping the shot. But the biggest asset of the cushion area is it compresses when the shell is fired allowing some cushion to the shot so there isn't so much deformation. I guess it just caught your attention because you saw it through a shell.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
3,132 Posts
The original WT12 wad was a stiffer/cheaper concoction of plastic than the OEM WAA12 wad. Not sure if that is the case anymore, but if you look at some of the Red Dot loads, the pressure changes when a WT12 wad is used in lieu of a AA12 wad.
When I got these wads (a couple months ago ?) I took a picture of them and some old shot that I bought from a buddy ( he's old too).
I asked here if ant had any knowledge about 'em and learned that they were made from recycled plastic to cut cost and they were kind of a 'budget' wad...

I ended up with 5 or 6 (?) bags of them. They shot & loaded fine. They are gone now.
I have a few of the bags right behind me and the data on the back all points to them as being old ! Gives data for Compression-Formed "Double A", RXP and Blue Magic hulls... I'm pretty sure they ain't made them recently or currently ? Hell, even the powders listed are before my time ! lol

WT12 018.JPG WT12 019.JPG WT12 020.JPG

Ps - I personally haven't been able to detect any difference in recoil due to a wad change... :28:
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
5,853 Posts
When I got these wads (a couple months ago ?) I took a picture of them and some old shot that I bought from a buddy ( he's old too).
I asked here if ant had any knowledge about 'em and learned that they were made from recycled plastic to cut cost and they were kind of a 'budget' wad...

I ended up with 5 or 6 (?) bags of them. They shot & loaded fine. They are gone now.
I have a few of the bags right behind me and the data on the back all points to them as being old ! Gives data for Compression-Formed "Double A", RXP and Blue Magic hulls... I'm pretty sure they ain't made them recently or currently ? Hell, even the powders listed are before my time ! lol

View attachment 1688657 View attachment 1688661 View attachment 1688663

Ps - I personally haven't been able to detect any difference in recoil due to a wad change... :28:
They were Winchester's answer to trying to stay competitive with Claybuster.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
175 Posts
I've used the clay buster version of the wt12s fora long time I like the feel of recoil from them better than regular aa12 wads although I haven't put them on a pattern board I seem to get better breaks with them. They seem to be a little stiffer so maybe they keep the shot column a little tighter.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
16,717 Posts
"Compression Formed AA" data is perfect for STS, Gun Club, and Nitro hulls.

FWIW I almost Never adjust my loader (Mec hydraulic Grabber). I always use the same wad, and I only change powder type and bar adjustments.
It's the KISS formula at its best.

HM
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
830 Posts
All I use are CBer wads. It seems if I use the wad intended for the payload, nothing needs adjusting. I use a 9000H, Grabber, two 650s- 20 & 28ga, and three different Jrs - a 10, 12, and 410. On second thought I do use something else for the 10 - Rem SP-10 wads. And for BP the fiber wads come into play.
 
1 - 20 of 27 Posts
Top