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Discussion Starter #1
After listening to different shooters talking at one of our local clubs yesterday I would like to pose the following question to the people here. Keep in mind this is not about one discipline versus another i.e. singles versus handicap. Just a general overview of where the game is today.

Would you rather break 99 and lose by one, or 94 and win by one?

Ken
 

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When you shoot a registered 16 yard event you have to break a 100 if you plan to win,anything less than that you will be the-FIRST LOOSER !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!(OR SECOND PLACE)

Sandy Holehouse.
 

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I agree with Sandy. Singles are 100 straight or nothing. Maybe in HDC a score of 94 might get you close to a shoot off for a yardage trophy.
In hdc you have to have 95's or better at PA'S State shoot to shoot off for place trophies.

Jason in PA
 

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I would rather break a 94 and win by one. Reason being, I could care less about averages, wins are the name of the game. They should throw out averages and just document a person's wins.
Steve Balistreri
 

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Win by one that's the name of the game. I don't care what I shoot if I win every time. Conditions attribute to the scores high or low...
 

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I would rather win by one. There are days where the conditions are such that the top dog shooters in the country shoot in the low 90s.

It's a contest between everyone out there on the field. Winning is the reason.
 

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This is a great question that everyone should ask themselves as the answer speaks volumes about what the sport means to you.

We all like to win but winning with a clean score is the best, especially when it is your shooting buddy knocking on the door with the 99. And even loosing with a 99 isn't too hard to take because you know that you shot a very good match.

One of my most cherished 'victories' was in shooting 100x100 in practice doubles and the the guy I shoot with regularly was next to me with a 99x100. Those were exceptional scores for both of us and my victory wasn't so much about beating my buddy as it was about defeating all those little gremilins that normally take a few targets off my score. At any rate, the beers do taste pretty good after an afternooon of this kind of shooting.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Yoda and Wolfram understand where I am going. Please remember this is not about handicap or singles but rather about what our sport has become and where it seems to be headed.

Are we on the right path or not? hummm

Ken
 

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Ken, I believe it was Vince Lombardi that said it, "Winning isn't everything, it's the only thing." Give me the 94 and the win anytime. If you don't care about winning, I believe you are in the minority. J.W.
 

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Don't get me wrong, J.Woolsey, I do like winning and it isn't like I haven't gotten into the winner circle with a 94 or less. But to me the original question was more about what do you prefer, taking a win with a so-so score or shooting a really decent score but not taking the win. I think a person wins anytime they exceed their normal performance level. If trapshooting was only about the actual trophy or cash brought home, 99.9% of us would be real loosers.

Here is a rephrase of the question (I think). Would you rather shoot a 200x200 singles score and then go on to loose the match in a shoot off or would you rather win the event outright with a lone score of 190 x 200? And just for extra bait we will say the prize is $500 and a really cool belt buckle.
 

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While we all want to win and take home the most money, and because I have done both above. I feel better with the 99 every time. I only made one mistake and I am human. Second is not that much different than first and I feel better about my shooting. A 94 is not what I am trying to achieve, while the 99 is very close. While I do shoot against others, REALLY I am shooting against myself. To Thine Own Self Be True. Are you really happy with a 94??? Break-em all. Jeff
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Please don't misunderstand me J.W.. I want to win as much as the next person. Remember this is not about winning or losing. It's about where our sport is heading.

Sorry about being vague. I want people to think outside the box.

Ken

p.s. FlaLagarto I was at the fall handicap this year. Wasn't that the most fun you have had in the last ten years. Weather is the great equalizer. I was one of a hand-full of shooters who managed to keep both scores in the 90's in the 2 handicaps on friday. I never made a dime but I felt great when I left that day.
 

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I am soooo sorry i read this thread, i feel like such a loser : ) I cannot imagine breaking a 95, much less a 99. Are you guys even human? Are robotics at play here? I think some Ninjas crept into your rooms at night and worked their magic on you.


Working on my first 50...John B.( i did do a 48/50 on doubles last week)
 

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Please don't crucify me : lose vs. loose. When you Loose something it is missing, gone, can't find it. Lose means you did not win.

Okay - I'm not competitive and can't shoot to save my life, but I really love it when I break those birds! Yeah! no other activity gives me the pleasure of blasting those clays apart! Call it beginner's enthusiasm, but I would rather score 99, because I'm so far from it :)
 

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There is no correct answer Paul, it is a question about how you view the game. Is it about winning and loosing or is it about pushing the limits of your own ability?

If it is about winning and loosing then I'm in trouble because I spend a whole bunch of money trying to get good enough to win just a little bit of it back. But I will tell you it feels really good when your buddies shake your hand and slap you on the back in congradulations for running an event (or even almost running it). At that point in time it doesn't matter if you won $1000 or $5 or still have to shoot it off, you made the summit and thats as good as it needs to get. None of that happens with a 94 even if you do have a nice payday coming.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
Time for the second part of the quiz;

At a large shoot If you play the lewis would you prefer, 5 classes split 50/30/20 or 5 classes paid 100% one money?

At a small shoot 3 classes 50/30/20 or 3 classes 100% one money.

Please, even the people who don't play the money give an answer as your opinion is just as important as those who do. It tells us what direction we are heading.

Ken
 

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Well I won more in the 60s & 70s shooting mid 90s score and the playing field was more equal with 3 hole targets! I say bring back the challenge of 3 hole and jack up the speed and watch those fat averages tumble. but for some reason the A.T.A. wants high averages. when I run them now I don't go to the shoot off, either it's a ought right win or a forfeit .
 

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Discussion Starter #20
SLID;

Are you shure it was because of three hole targets?

Over-all I think averages have dropped in the last ten years. Hummmm I wonder why?

Ken
 
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