Trapshooters Forum banner

1 - 20 of 38 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
692 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I am using International Clays in a STS hull. Ran out of Remington primers and have Winchester 209. I was getting 1180 fps with the Remington primers with a charge of 18.8 grains. If I use the 20.7 on their web site, it is way over 1200 and they really kick. So, It looks that I have to reduce the load with Winchesters. Question is, how much to use. BTW, the velocities were with a chronograph.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
6,023 Posts
18.8 International using a Rem. 209/Fig 8 style wad and 1.125oz shot would be roughly an 1100fps load not 1180fps according to Hogdon site.

20.7gr International using a Win 209 and everything else the same would be a strong 1250-1260fps load.

That's why recoil was so apparent.

You want to be dropping somewhere down around 17.5gr International with the Win 209 to equal the velocity you've been experiencing with your Rem 209 primer load.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,678 Posts
Just off the top of my head I don't know if I ever remember seeing any load data where it
DIDN,T State to reduce the powder when changing from Remington to Winchester Primers. I might be wrong but this has always been the rule of thumb. Since day one Winchester Primers have always been as hotter then the Remington,s
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
692 Posts
Discussion Starter · #8 ·
18.8 International using a Rem. 209/Fig 8 style wad and 1.125oz shot would be roughly an 1100fps load not 1180fps according to Hogdon site.

20.7gr International using a Win 209 and everything else the same would be a strong 1250-1260fps load.

That's why recoil was so apparent.

You want to be dropping somewhere down around 17.5gr International with the Win 209 to equal the velocity you've been experiencing with your Rem 209 primer load.

20.7 was with a Remington primer. Backed it down to 18.8. I used my chronograph to get the velocity. I always remember International as being a soft shooting powder not like it is now. I agree with your suggestion of 17.5.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
8,596 Posts
20.7 was with a Remington primer. Backed it down to 18.8. I used my chronograph to get the velocity. I always remember International as being a soft shooting powder not like it is now. I agree with your suggestion of 17.5.
The problem is that NO powder recoils softer or harder!
If the speed of the shell are the same & the payload weight are the same, every powder in the world will have the same recoil.
Now, you might not want to believe this, but it has been proven in blind tests numourus times and not one participant could determine a difference.
MG
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
692 Posts
Discussion Starter · #10 ·
End result with my testing. I shot the Winchester primers against the Remington used as a control. The Winchester was no higher in velocity than the Remington. Cant speak for pressure but that is not stated on a box of ammo. My chronograph said they were, virtually, the same as Remington. So, I will not be changing my load, based on what I have found.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
66 Posts
Why would anyone shoot Remington primers when you can shoot many other primers for half the cost and it will give you the same results
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
692 Posts
Discussion Starter · #13 · (Edited)
I had a stash of Remington primers, that's why I used them. And I thought they produced less recoil. Load Cheddite Primers and see what happens to that factor.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,583 Posts
What will you do with the money you’ll be saving by switching to Winchester from the overpriced and overrated Remington primers?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,107 Posts
Why would anyone shoot Remington primers when you can shoot many other primers for half the cost and it will give you the same results
Because I still have 10 thousand to use up from a bulk buy 15 years ago?

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk
 
  • Like
Reactions: Boxo53 and mg1polo

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
3,417 Posts
End result with my testing. I shot the Winchester primers against the Remington used as a control. The Winchester was no higher in velocity than the Remington. Cant speak for pressure but that is not stated on a box of ammo. My chronograph said they were, virtually, the same as Remington. So, I will not be changing my load, based on what I have found.
Kolar12 -- When testing over my Oehler 35, changing noting but the primer - I have had similar results to what you have reported here.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
742 Posts
Kolar12 -- When testing over my Oehler 35, changing noting but the primer - I have had similar results to what you have reported here.
So, I have seen test results from various loads. When looking at the velocity differences between the loads, the results were greatly similar, but there was a big difference in pressure readings. Where are the pressure readings that you got with your chrono??? That's what I thought. For all you know, you have a load that is well in excess of pressure limits listed.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,132 Posts
Powder has no effect on recoil.
I know that the lack of powder makes a huge difference in recoil. I had a couple of reloads that lacked any powder. My charge bar got stuck you see. I could really notice how comfortable it was to shoot that shell without any powder at all!!! But the darn target did not break. Mmm break em all Jeff
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
8,596 Posts
Kolar12 -- When testing over my Oehler 35, changing noting but the primer - I have had similar results to what you have reported here.
As long as the data supports a primer Substitution, that would be correct.
The problem is when there is only data for the Remington primer, you just can't swap to a Winchester or any other primer and expect the same ballistic results. You would have absolutely NO idea where your pressure or speed would be!
MG
 
1 - 20 of 38 Posts
Top