Colonel; Thank you for the up date, this what this web is for. With information like this I feel like I'm part of this growing place, from nothing to one of a kind place to do what ever shooting sport there is.
ALOHA NUI LOA, pineapple
Thanks for the update but I'm sure the naysayers will contend you were: paid, under the influence, not in your right mind or mistaken. If memory serves me right Savannah used to host the Skeet Worlds until it was taken away and moved to Texas therefore would have machines (older). Good.
NSSA used to haul a bunch of old Winchester single stack machines to Forest City Gun club for temporary installation at the Masters. I believe that they always took them back afterward. The Masters will no longer be in Savanah...so, I guess these machines are excess.
I would not characterize them as top quality nor the temp installation as what you would desire for a major tournament.
50 million dollar facility with 50 year old traps? Negative? Labor intensive in a big shoot and prone to breakage. I have a set here at home. I wouldn`t want to maintain them for a 500 shooter tourney. Got no dog in this fight. facts are facts.
Did they also mention that the tourney has been limited to 300 shooters? Not enough machines. Depending on government for shooting is no different than depending on a politician to defend your guns. Its a crap shoot. Thats not negative either its a fact.
I talked to a gentleman today who worked at the mine that was there years ago(?) and rented a parking space for his motorhome for the next five years, and he indicated that the facility was second to none. He also said, sure things need to be done but it all takes time. He also indicated that Ohio couldn't hold a candle to this place. They even hold weddings there at one facility.
BIGDON - let me apologize if it appeared that I was trying to bash the shoot. I hope for nothing but absolute success for Cliff and Briley for this shoot.
Also, I have nothing against Win single stacks, when well maintained and set up they throw good targets and I also like "hearing" the target coming. Yes, they are more work to trap, but that is an addressable issue and I have shot many good events with Win single stack machines.
Let me be a bit more precise, I thought that the targets at the Masters, a relatively high dollar shoot, were not the best on the fields with the temp machines brought in....this is just my experience there. It is a big challenge to truck in machines and get them refreshed and set up properly. This challenge gets even bigger with brand new houses, stakes, electrical wiring, etc all going in at relatively the last minute.
They have a lot of work to do to be tournament ready by the 8th of June. This does not mean I don't think that they can do so.
If anybody can do it, I assume that Cliff and Briley can. I believe that the more recent attitude by Forest City toward the Masters (they didn't seem to want it there anymore) certainly contributed significantly to those items (including field and target quality) that caused my disappointment with that shoot.
Klink ... somebody at a booth at a convention is your source of contact?
This is not in any way shape or form an attack upon the ATA or the Sparta but directly from the letter by Cliff Moller on the Brileys site ... "NSSA comes to the rescue promising to pull traps out of their skeet houses at NSC, offering to supply most of the traps required for the tournament."
The NSC (National Shooting Complex) is in San Antonio, TX not where you think he said. Yes the complex will have machines for the upcoming shoot ... but they are not machines owned by the complex or the State of Illinois but by the NSSA. I can also understand the person thinking that of course the machines would stay because he probably thinks they are going to be the property of the range but ... why would NSSA come to the rescue and offer to help by removing there machines from there own skeet houses and shipping them to Sparta for Briley to use at there event.
I thank you for updating the world on the WSC at Sparta but ... well ... if you walked into Wal-Mart and asked the kid at the camera department about which fish hook is best to use for mountain gorrila fishing I'm sure he thinks he can can answer all the questions you have but are they at all close to being correct?
I would bet quite a bit of money that these machines are NOT coming out of the NSC houses (they use Laportes, I believe) but are the additional Win machines I spoke of being used at the old Masters, etc.
As to why NSSA is jumping to the rescue, well...it don't hurt that its Briley, a major NSSA sponsor, running the shoot.
I understand that Briley is paying to transport them, good enough...I believe these machines basically sit around other wise.
Collonel Klink ... you talked to him and I didnt, dang ya know your right but we both know that you probably spoke with some guy who works at Sparta and really has no 100% solid clue of what happens there. It seems though that now the rep told you a bunch more than what you told people in your update ... which once again I thank you for but it seems you aint tellin it all.
I tend to trust what a trusted person in the shooting industry says when they say that the State of Illinois canceled the machine contract due to budget problems. Like any government all they care about is the $$$ and not about much more and if it was not for the NSSA then people would have gotten screwed.
BTW ... who owns the trap machines at the WSC? Didnt the ATA have to pay a large chunk of the money for machines at the WSC? Why should the state pay for any machines at all if they can force others to purchase machines to install into there facility.
Thanks again for the update ... is there anything else you have not mentioned yet?
The ATA owns all of the trap machines at the WSC in Sparta and they paid for them not the State of Illinois ... The State of Illinois uses them and rents them back to the ATA members for $3.00 per event for the Grand American, not sure about any of the other shoots held there ... WPT ... (YAC) ...