Machine, I own and shoot both along with p-guns, no axe to grind, shoot both, adjust the k-80 to your liking and have at it, then shoot a Seitz remember to shoot one that shoots higher, at least 6 inches higher to make up for the faster trigger, unfortunately many shooters who have tried to shoot Seitz and Bowens were not made aware of this and subsequently had trouble shooting them when shooting back to back with their K guns and P guns, shoot both, just make sure when you buy your Seitz to have it impact the same as the Seitz you shot successfully. enjoy your journey! incinerate em!