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PW 800B rebuild

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Did some work on a snowblower for a guy from the club and he gave me this 800B for the effort.
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The primer tray is smashed and the plastic cover is missing.

The machine actually indexes in the wrong direction. Whiz has directions on how to deal with this, so will follow those.

I've purchased a new primer ram and primer post from Whiz, so I'm good there. They need upgrading in a bad way.

Whiz's thumb drive with technical documentation is on it's way. Here we go.
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Proper rotation is right to left (clockwise)as viewed from a plan view. Has to be the index pad/star wheel timing is hosed up. Note that the hollow shaft base with its helical machined slot that the index pad rides up and down in can develop a burr that impedes proper travel and if any of the teeth on the star wheel are worn it can be disassembled and reversed exposing the side of the teeth that have never been in contact (meshed) yet with the main index gear.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 · (Edited)
I have had 3-800B's in my day and yes the loader goes,from left to right as it cycles,this is normal.It will load a quality looking shell,once you get it set up properly.The info from Whiz,will help.
It can't possibly go from left to right based on the dies. On the right hand side, you insert the shell so it can be resized. Then to the left of that the primer is removed and a new one is inserted. To the left of that is the powder drop, then the wad, to the left again and so on around to the back for shot, crimping and out. It's most definitely from right to left from the front of machine.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
...Note that the hollow shaft base with its helical machined slot that the index pad rides up and down in can develop a burr that impedes proper travel and if any of the teeth on the star wheel are worn it can be disassembled and reversed exposing the side of the teeth that have never been in contact (meshed) yet with the main index gear.
Thanks. Will be looking at that first.
 

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If you need to remove the die holder from the machine there are 2 set screws in each hole. Also if your in there replace the springs that hold the indexing balls down. Found this to cause the indexing to be slightly out of time. These are great machines, but they require tinkering to get them dialed in. Your also talking to one of the best for help on repair when your talking to Whiz.
 

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'07 Kolar Max TA 3bbl set, Jeff Mainland fitted
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BTW, I understand that Jean the 800B Goddess is back to work. I sent my wreck to her & had the removable die setup installed, effectively making it an 800+, only better, in my view. Jim Skeel can fix you up with the top plate that will improve it a lot. Think about the electric drive unit for it. Money wise, you're way ahead of the game.

 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
...Note that the hollow shaft base with its helical machined slot that the index pad rides up and down in can develop a burr that impedes proper travel...
Checked and it looks ok to me.
...and if any of the teeth on the star wheel are worn it can be disassembled and reversed exposing the side of the teeth that have never been in contact (meshed) yet with the main index gear.
Not seeing ANY wear on that gear. Here's a peak from both angles at the back. I know the pictures aren't that good, but in person, the machine looks to be hardly used at all. This implies that it is just out of adjustment. More on that later as I've printed out the directions from Whiz.
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...Has to be the index pad/star wheel timing is hosed up...
What I am seeing is this when the handle is all the way down. More movement to go at that bottom red arrow, but the top red arrow shows the index pin is all the way compressed.
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The handle felt a little 'squishy' when pushed all the way back, so I took a picture with the handle not quite all the way back. You can see in this next picture that this machine has been bottoming out at the black grease lines on the outer guides.
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Compare those last two pictures and see in the first that the machine is indeed bottomed out all the way. Time to get Whiz's directions out and try to make an adjustment...
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
If you need to remove the die holder from the machine there are 2 set screws in each hole. Also if your in there replace the springs that hold the indexing balls down. Found this to cause the indexing to be slightly out of time. These are great machines, but they require tinkering to get them dialed in. Your also talking to one of the best for help on repair when your talking to Whiz.
The dies are definitely off center with the silver resizing tubes. Will be looking at that next. Thanks for the tip.
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Yes, the shells feed to the left and rotate to the last punch out station where the punch out ram is located.If you ever go and remove the die plate with the dies in it for cleaning,do not unbolt that metal center plate that sit's on top of the plate,you will wish you didn't.Also if you remove the die plate with the dies in it, a tip is to wrap all the die's with a strong
rubber band,this will hold the dies in place,when you go to put the assembly back on the machine.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Set screw at red arrow was completely loose!
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You can see all the markings where it was set in different places on the index pad housing.
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So I followed Whiz's directions and got the gap at this red arrow set to the width of my debit card.
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The handle is moving things in the correct direction now.

Next I have to get the dies centered with the silver resizing tubes.

But first, it's time to walk my yellow lab...
 

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Also,never put a large amount of force to index the machine,there were people years ago that did and would force a break on the index pad.Once dialed in the index pin will slip right off of the pad and you will hear a normal click,when this happens,it is a normal indication of a machine cycle.
 

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^^^ Thats looks like a fun machine right there.

I would want it on the bench a little more with some 'side-boards' to catch any spilled shot though...
Oh, it's firmly bolted to that table, solid as a rock. It's out there to allow room for the 250 shell catch tray in back. No spilled shot from this one with the electric drive unit & Jim's top with the gear rack nylon screws to tame it. I've got three primer tray/tracks & keep 'em in service with JB Weld to repair the top seam when it quits. I know how to set up the primer post with Wizz's hardened post with a big mother modified "C" clamp with the pad removed (the ball fits the primer pocket) to make fine adjustments during assembly. It's a great loader! Oh, BTW, I have the very first PVC pipe drop tube PW made for the last station to direct the shells into the tray instead of the "clangey" springey thingey. One more little trick: On the brass surface facing you, on the primer ram assembly, where the track goes in? Paint that surface with red fluorescent paint so that you see RED when the primers are "hung" up and not feeding. You see the red paint just before the powder starts filling your spent primer can. (you can thank me for this one, later) grin...
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 · (Edited)
Also,never put a large amount of force to index the machine,there were people years ago that did and would force a break on the index pad.Once dialed in the index pin will slip right off of the pad and you will hear a normal click,when this happens,it is a normal indication of a machine cycle.
I'm hearing it!

Any clue how to get it to turn exactly the right amount? Sometimes I have to move it a tiny bit so the ejector die doesn't catch on the silver resizing tube like you see here:
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Discussion Starter · #20 · (Edited)
I tried lining up the dies over the resizing tubes by lowering this according to Whiz's directions.

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Big mistake. Then everything stopped working. The machine wouldn't cycle at all. I probably mis-read Whiz's directions. I went to the gear underneath and flipped it around thinking one side was worn per suggestion above. Nope. Still wouldn't work.

So I called in a machinist, my son and we figured it out. In the end, we had to move that part in the picture above back so it was flush with the base it's mounted in like this:

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We spent about an hour taking everything apart and cleaning it, right down to the 2 big ball bearings and springs. Then we put it all back together and studied how it works and tweaked it until we got the handle working again. Then I took this video to demonstrate.


There's a lot going on in this video...It's a real study in screws, stops, springs and sprokets....If you right click on the video you can put it into a loop and study it until you understand it better. Have fun. We sure did. (Why don't he fix that squeak?)
 
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