Trapshooters Forum banner
Status
Not open for further replies.
1 - 20 of 32 Posts

·
Banned
Joined
·
2,644 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
MX2's are a topfirst firing bunker gun. ATA shooters seem dedicated to destroying them by having aftermarket chokes cut into them. Other than that they are just the MX8 action w/ a top first trigger-barrel arrangement. The top first feature was/is a sort of pigeon and bunker shooter preference for a while. I have a top first Mirage and see no advantage or disadvantage. Might be easier to load a single round into the top barrel but past that .......

If you don't want/need a tight choked excellent bunker gun you might consider passing on the MX2 and get more what you are looking for. I'm sure there are shooters out there that would feel no need to modify that gun in any way.

just a thot
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,088 Posts
Semperfi909 got your answer.

MX-2 is the same as MX-1 with a different rib. The reverse firing barrels are not very popular these days.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,866 Posts
Steve, does the MX-1 have the reversed firing order too? Don't both guns have very light barrels with no side ribs?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,270 Posts
Cant you switch out the selector to B/T firing?

I assume the top bbl usually shoots high,and the bottom shoots flat on these top/bottom order bbl guns?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,717 Posts
My MX-3 is probably a Bunker gun because it is choked 000 and 0 which is .028 and .042 constriction. I believe the ATA Trap guns were choked a little more open but mine works just fine for ATA Doubles and both barrels shoot about the same POI 70/30 with my beads stacked.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,088 Posts
Avaldes,

Yes, MX-1 is the same, but with different rib.

You can change the firing order with different triggers or selector, but the barrels are choked tighter on the bottom.

You can go the extra mile to put in choke tubes in it and new trigger to make it shoot like a MX-8, but you'll end up spending the same amount of money buying a MX-8.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
980 Posts
When Perazzi created the top barrel first version they also bent the top barrel a little (upward) to insure that it shot higher - primarily for pigeons but the Italian Team that shot them also shot bunker with the same gun type - but, Like Semperfi mentioned, it did not get much play. I also had a SC#/DB81 Live Bird 28 3/8 barrel w/Choke tube that I never could shoot well and it patterned where it was supposed to shoot for me.

I agreed (With Perazzi) that the first barrel must shoot high when looking down the rib but I preferred a bottom barrel that shot 60+/40- and a top barrel that was close to 55/45 for pigeon shooting and that led me down the path of incontinence with respect to patterning.

I never bought a Perazzi after 1980 unless I patterened first with AA Pigeon loads or Rem/Fed 1 1/4 3 1/4 of 8's and got what I wanted. When Briley first started making eccentric chokes I tried them and I like them to give me a little more adjustment to a gun I already like.

Regards,

Bill
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
596 Posts
I have an original MX1 (as opposed to the current version,which is nothing more than a flat rib MX8), as well as a MX2L. The barrels on both shoot the same POI.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
980 Posts
At MOP - That is rare and a 'keeper' if the same POI is about 50/50 or 55/45 as you can make changes more than that with your stock comb.. Shooting to same POI is rare for Any shotgun, O/U or SxS.

Intentional or otherwise. Regulating is an art form for London Guns and all Italian/Spanish SxS gunmakers. Perazzi and Fabbri and Berettameventually got great quality control with their tooling and processes. but it is hard - and aftermarket gunsmiths that claim to be able to break a side rib from an O/U or center rib from SxS and re-regulate to original POI - don't.

Curiously many Browning Superposed O/U shot bottom barrel 50/50 and top barrel high - pretty consistently across all gauges. I had similar results with Beretta SO series but the sample size was only a couple of guns.

For that matter, while I have run through a lot of Perazzi's and Brownings over 50 years, the number is probably not enough to be statistically important.

Take what you want and leave the rest.

Regards,

Bill

Regards,

Bill
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
596 Posts
Drgondog - I had the same experience as you with the Superposed. No experience with SO's. All of the several Perazzi's I've owned with various rib configurations have been regulated to the same or nearly the same POI. All were late 70's and early 80's production.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,866 Posts
Thanks Steve, I only asked because I recently saw an MX1 for sale, at Pacific Sporting if I recall, and it looked very much like an MX8. I'm not looking for any kind of project gun, it was just an interesting find that I don't see all that often.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
980 Posts
MOP - I suspect we are picking fine hairs on 'same vs nearly the same"

For me a 2" differnce is meaningful and important for the way I shoot - for some that is 'nearly the same'.

I don't mean to quibble just presenting some observations.

Some background -I had conversations with both Matterelli and Perazzi in the very early seventies when they were approaching Billy Hodge (Buckhorn) to be their US distributor and Billy is the gent that seduced me into shooting pigeons to my eternal woe.

It was around the time Winchester was introducing the Winchoke and the conversation turned to the US Pigeon Shooting market - dominated by Browning but giving up ground rapidly with the Perazzi. The Euro flyer shooters were switching to Perazzi and asking for a higher shooting first shot than the Mirage/MX8 had at the time. IIRC the MX2 was the first attempt at meeting this objective andthe choke tube was also important because Columbaire and Box flyers often would like to shoot one gun - and I was one of those (but I had zero influence in that discussion).

The 1973-1975 timeframe saw a lot of changes, including Stan Baker introducing the Win Choke by swaging the barrels on separated rib guns (M32, K80) and Jess Briley about 75-76(?) to meet the variable choke market.

I never owned a MX1 or 2 and I was shooting the SHO which shot the way I wanted it, but I had some insight on the 'why'. I later went from the 29 5/8 to 28 3/8 Mirage and had Briley choke both barrels when I started shooting Internat'l Skeet and shot that gun at everything for years. My sons have most of my stuff now.

Long rambling story - just to illustrate that Danielle had problems making his MX8/Mirage shoot a lower barrel more than a couple of inches high and was looking for ways to satisfy that demand.

Regards,

Bill
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
980 Posts
That is a tough question - I see an awful lot of 'nearly new', Excellent, Very Good condition, unaltered for sale lately

The prices rabge for the above condition $4500 - $6200 for MX8/Mirage's

The first question is "what does the seller want?" as a starting point - then the second is what are you willing to pay for the Mirage/MX8 as a comparison?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
980 Posts
My last thought is - whatever you would pay for a really good MX8/Mirage, I would deduct at least $500 simply because it will be harder to re-sell should you not like it.

Regards,

Bill
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
2,644 Posts
Discussion Starter · #18 ·
On the POI thing. I certainly wish that I could shoot patterns and targets consistently enough to worry about a couple inches. 'Specially the target stuff hahaha

At any rate, I have. have had, a number of O/U guns (prolly a dozen Perazzi barrels laying around here right now) and I have yet to see one that was properly regulated horizontally that didn't shoot to the same vertical POI w/ both barrels. I'm sure my incompetence at the pattern board could account for some of that but the trend ............... etc. And that is what I expect to see.

Altho my experience is meager in the pigeon ring, I have seen too many birds "stall" just above the box and go for the ground to want a first barrel shooting high. And why would I want to have to remember to accommodate that difference? Shooting the bunker, every target is rising and why would I want barrels that shoot to a different POI? If anything I think I'd want a 2nd barrel to shoot high to kill the drop in the pattern (that is pretty much inconsequential too). But then, I'm not a world champ and my ratiocinations are right at the GAF level, eh? Personally I'm aware that I'm just too simple minded and too much a hack to take all that crap into account when I'm shooting and if I would take the time to think about it, well, I lose enough targets as it is.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
2,644 Posts
Discussion Starter · #19 ·
On the money thing

Decide what you want in the new gun

Survey the market place

What's it worth to you?

Can you flip it if you don't like it?

Does the seller like it more than you do?

NEVER make an impulse buy w/out having the above in hand

Actually, I've never been able to do all that but it's still a good idea
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,792 Posts
Charlie,those stalled out pigeons are the culls used up for practice. The whole idea is to be able to see the bird, wherever it goes. They can and do switch direction instantly. Race birds are better! I've tried a lot of things over the years, including a Krieghoff set up to shoot lots higher with the first(bottom)bbl. Like you say, too much thinking required for 2nd bbl. Auto loaders don't kick as much, both shots to the same place, but a compromise on the choking. My current MX-11 seemed to shoot slightly high top bbl.so I had Kolar make me a slight eccrentic bottom tube, now very slightly higher than top bbl. Why top first, you ask? That puzzled me for years, until I learned the European shooters liked a heavier load for the 2nd shot, and bottom bbl. kicks a little less.My solution was to minimize recoil on 1st shot to stay in the gun better for 2nd shot. The more you shoot, the higher you want the POI.
 
1 - 20 of 32 Posts
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top