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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Does anyone have access to a copy of loading data printed for Nobel Sport powder? I have been searching the web and can only find comparative burn rates.
Tim
 

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Graf's blacked out all the shotshell data, BPI has tested a few loads with it and GM3. Prima V is pretty dense, like the Winchester ball powders.
 

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Tim....
I'm loading the Vectan GM3 for 1 1/8oz handicap loads. I have a copy of the reloading data I got from Grafs. I'm loading 22.5gr of GM3 in a Federal Gold Medal hull, windjammer wad, and Federal primer. I also noticed that Grafs had blacked out the data for shotguns so I called the tech dept. I was told that the printed data they supplied for shotgun loads was not correct when it came to only the "higher end of the chart" with speeds in the 1300fps plus range. The 1200-1250fps data is correct. If you would like a copy of the data, give me your email address and I will be happy to send it to you........
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Dan,
I bought a small can of Vectan Prima V to try on 1 ounce loads. I can't find a thinmg on this powder except that some dealers have it for sale. The blacked out "bad ata" pages are found when you go to the manufacturers web site as well. Any info would be appreciated for the Prima V powder

Thanks

Tim Miller
 

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Tim...
Check your email. I just sent you the Vectan reloading guide that also covers the Prima V.... Dan
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Mokeman3,
Thank you for the Vectan information. I appreciate your effort.
I have loaded some Rem STS with 18.5 grains of Vectan Prima V, TGT12 wad and Cheditte primer for a trial run.
My first load was the 21.5 grains as shown in the chart. It seems very fast (no chrono) and a little too much for a one ounce load.
 

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For what it's worth, I'm loading the GM-3 powder for 1 1/8oz handicap loads. The data calls for 23.1gr , Cheddite primer, Windjammer wad, to get 1250fps. I loaded up some Estate hulls using this data and found that it was a little more than I wanted. Very fast, (no chrono) however, not much cheek slap when shot. Played with a few other recipes and I finally settled on this load: 22.5gr. GM-3, Gold Medal hull, Fed. primer, Windjammer wad, and 492gr. #8 magnum shot. Shot this load last night over the chronograph from 5' using 5 shots as an average. Now, understand I don't have Neil's pension for exact figures, however, they ran like this: #1-1220fps, #2-1225fps, #3-1228fps, #4-1223fps, and #5-1229fps. This for an average, over the 5 shots of 1225fps. I also ran 5 shots using the published data over the chrono, using 23.1gr and got this: #1-1269fps, #2-1271fps, #3-1277fps, #4-1275fps, and #5-1274fps. This for and average, over the 5 shots, of 1273fps. I shot these loads from my MX3 Special 34" Seitz barrel. Barrel is back bored to .742" with a .708" choke. (038"). The loads shot very well with very mild recoil. I am probably going to order another 20lbs from Grafs and use it for my primary handicap load since Green Dot has all but disappeared from the planet....
 

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I am doing some loading using the AS powder. 1 1/8 oz and Tapered hulls and 18.5 gr give 1150fps. 19.4 grains gives 1210 in straight wall cases. Super clean powder........ Larry
 

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Pete... I agree. I'm pretty sold on this powder for now. Great stuff. Burns clean, is consistent, and meters through my 9000H as good, or better, than any other powder I have used. Time will tell, but, I now have 22lbs of it to carry me through the Green Dot shortage. If this powder continues to be what I hope it will be, my Green Dot days may be coming to an end....
 

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I have loaded some Rem STS with 18.5 grains of Vectan Prima V, TGT12 wad and Cheditte primer for a trial run.
In 1-ounce I presume ?

Based on BPI's 1-1/8th oz data posted above, 18.5 grains would probably be too much in a taper hull (such as a AA HS, or Remington) for 1-ounce, and definitely too much for 1-1/8th oz.

My first load was the 21.5 grains as shown in the chart. It seems very fast (no chrono) and a little too much for a one ounce load.
In what hull, and what shot payload ? If in a taper'd hull (such as a Remington hull), 21.5 grains would be way-way too much (for any payload).

In the 17.8 grains (Prima-V) 1-oz loads in black Remington Game loads (gun clubs) w/ Rio primers that I mentioned above, I shot a box of them this last Wednesday night at my night Trap shooting venue in my Benelli Cordoba (because it was raining). And based on how they felt in that gun, and how they were breaking the targets and how far the Benelli Cordoba was ejecting the hulls, I get the feeling that even 17.8 grains might be a little too much (for 1-oz), and may be boarder line pressure wise.

I'm going to back down one bushing (from a MEC #27 to a MEC #26) in that load today, and chrono that load. I know the Rio G-600 primer is hotter than a Winchester W-209, so maybe it's making that load hotter than the 1225 fps Test String #2 that I chorno'd above (with a W209 primer) even with .2 grains less powder.

The stuff does meter well, burns clean, doesn't have any objectionable odor, and really seems like a quality powder and performs well. And that's no surprise either considering that it's really an OEM-grade powder, as opposed to some retail/canister-grade "do all" powder like you might experience with promo/Red dot, etc. etc.
 

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Just got back from the range, 18.5 of AS, 1 1/8 shot, CFAA hull, CB1118 wad, Fed primer. Feels mild, shot good... Larry
 

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And I'm just heading "out" to the range. I'll be chono testing these two loads:

1) 1-oz #8 in Remington STS's, green duster, 17.0 grains Prima-V w/ Rio G-600.
2) 7/8th's oz #8 in Remington STS's, CB0178, 17.0 gains Prima-V w/ Rio-G600.

Mostly interested to see if load #1 above will cycle my Benelli Cordoba.
 

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Same hull, same shot, same wad with Federal primer and 17.5 gr AS cycles my CS. I suspect you will have no issues. I have ordered loading data from UK, have not seen it yet but their might be some interesting information in it.......... for example, how many millions psi of pressure am I developing with some of my "testing". Perhaps I don't want to know??? Larry
 

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Ok, so I tested (chrono & shooting) 17.0 grains of Prima-V in both, 1-ounce, and 7/8th's ounce in green STS's ...



So load #1 is what I've been shooting lately (which felt sorta hot), but I guess it's not all that hot (velocity wise).

Reducing powder one MEC bushing (from #27 to #26) wrecked the load, both in 1-ounce and 7/8th's ounce. 17.0 grains in these configurations is too light, and not burning completely. You can tell by the thick smoke that rolls out of the chamber after firing, and as you can see, both were less than 1200 fps, and they started to get unstable (as seen with the increasing EV & SD figures).

The 7/8th's oz load at that slow of a speed was seriously "hot-coring" big time. If/when you could center the target, breaks were complete. I did manage to get a 23 at 16-yard Trap with the slow 7/8th's oz loads (just to use the shells up). I would not recommend dropping to 17.0 grains of Prima-V in either 1-ounce, or 7/8th's ounce in the taper'd Remington hulls. 17.7-17.8 grains however (in 1-ounce) is an absolute target evaporator. So that is what I'll stick with. I'll also test that 17.8 grains in 7/8th's oz, but suspect it will be just as spectacular as the 1-ounce version.
 

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Ah, - the most important question(s) I forgot to answer ...

The 17.0 grain, 1173 fps one ounce load did indeed cycle the Benelli Cordoba with authority, and the 17.0 grain 7/8th's ounce did not cycle.

Which actually raises more questions than it answers actually. For years I've spoke "in the other forum" about how this Benelli Cordoba requires more than 1200 fps (in 1-ounce) to cycle, and the trials and tribulations that I've had with the Fiocchi Fio 616 primer with Clays powder in the Fiocchi straight-wall hulls. To this day this still hold true. Low and behold, I get a dark green STS to cycle my Cordoba with less than 1200 fps (with Prima-V powder).

So in a surprising twist, it seems that I've discovered that there is apparently some other phenomenon that contributes to the actual muzzle velocity that is required to cycle the inertia-driven Benelli Cordoba. Maybe it's the smoother, slicker hull surface of the glossy dark green STS's, or it's pure brass head stamp (or some combination therein), or there's something associated with the time/pressure peak with the faster-burning Prima-V in a different geometry hull (taper'd STS vs. straight-wall Fiocchi hull). It's a most interesting finding that I honestly don't understand.

Years of such discussions with the so-called experts in that "other forum" would have you believe that it's strictly muzzle (exit) velocity which determines (felt?) recoil, and subsequently the "inertia" forces needed to cycle the bolt in an inertia-driven Benelli Cordoba, but my data isn't showing that. Two different shells with ~1200 fps muzzle (exit) velocity cycle the gun differently (ergo, one "does", and one does "NOT). Do I dare bring this up in that other forum in hopes of stimulating meaningful, "civil" debate? - not on a bet !
 

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One of the continual complaints about trap shooting with a semiautomatic is the need to clean the gun often and clean it well. I shoot a competition synthetic and while some powders allowed me to clean less frequently the need was still there after 250 to 300 rounds. The use of the Vectan powder has allowed me to go to twice that number with no real need to clean then. Perhaps those shooters that have recoil issues will now be able to utilize a semiautomatic and Vectan powder to increase their shooting pleasure........ Larry
 

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One of the continual complaints about trap shooting with a semiautomatic is the need to clean the gun often and clean it well. I shoot a competition synthetic and while some powders allowed me to clean less frequently the need was still there after 250 to 300 rounds. The use of the Vectan powder has allowed me to go to twice that number with no real need to clean then. Perhaps those shooters that have recoil issues will now be able to utilize a semiautomatic and Vectan powder to increase their shooting pleasure........ Larry
Yeah, - no lie....

What a blast from the past! - I found this old thread of mine in a Google search tonight while looking for Prima-V chrono data.

I've been involved with reloading Rio hulls, and other straight-wall hulls for so long, I totally forgot about testing Prima-V in taper hulls.

I'm completely out of Vectan AS, and have a bunch of Vectan Prima-V that I need to use up, so I'm going to re-visit this load, and re-test it tomorrow, and start making up some of these loads (from test string 1 above at is).
 
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