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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
My son is in his 2nd year on his school's trap team. He is shooting decently but looking to pick up a few more clays so he can be more competitive. We have been spending some time on the patterning board lately. He is shooting a Benelli Super Sport and currently has the middle of the road in height snap in comb in the gun. He is shooting the factory extended Benelli IM from the 16. I have tried numerous other chokes in this gun and the factory one has thrown the best pattern. He is shooting left. I have had him mount the gun and I look down the end of the barrel for his eye placement and it always appears to be in the center. The shot pattern appears to be a little high as you will see in the attachment, but I am not as concerned with that right now as I am about getting him more centered left to right. I have had the barrel off of the gun and placed a spent cartridge in the barrel to check for straightness as described in other threads here. I am no gunsmith but from what I have read here about using this test, it appears that the barrel is straight. I do have the factory snap in comb which has no height to it, it would sit flush with the top of the butt stock. Looking for advice on how to move his shot pattern to the right to maybe collect those few more clays.

I seen there are some other threads that talk about this topic prior to me posting this, but all of the ones that I found dealt with guns with adjustable combs. I apologize in advance if non-adjustable comb adjustment has been discussed before and I just did not run across it. Your advice is greatly appreciated.

Terry
 

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If it doesn't have an adjustable comb your only real option is to add some material to the side of the comb to move your face away from the stock like a cheek-eez pad or remove some material from the comb with a rasp or some sandpaper to move your face into the stock ....unfortunately I believe the second remedy is what is need to solve your problem but check with someone who knows for sure before taking a rasp to it,Tron would be a good option to check with.Jerry
 

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You need to move the comb (stock) to the right quite a bit. How many times did you shoot it on paper, and was it from a bench? Do you have the right hand shim in the stock? I had Tron make a thicker shim that was tapered to move my stock (Beretta Xtrema) even farther right. Stock shims give you more cast, but not offset.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
There was only one shot at that particular piece of paper. We were testing chokes yesterday and shot 6 different ones. All of them were about that far left. I bought the gun used and the guy I bought it from didn't have the stock shims anymore. I had my son free stand all of the shots. Sounds like I may need to talk to Tron about making me a shim as well.
 

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If you are shooting to the left of where you are looking, you need to move your eye to the right. There are different ways to do that, but if you are shooting in relationship to the barrel, that is what needs to be done.

I would also have him shoot one eyed, to eliminate cross dominance. If his left eye is taking over, it will line the bead up to the right, and shoot to the left.

I would also have someone else shoot the gun, to see if it is the gun, or the shooter.
 

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Always move the stock the direction you want the shot placement to go. Up, raise comb; down, lower comb. In your case the comb needs to be moved to the right as you want the POI to move to the right.

However, what I would do first is be sure when he is mounting the gun, it is as close to his collarbone as possible , that just might fix your problem. This simple thing has cause me problems over the years, the gun mount is CRITICAL to shooting success. I would go to 20 yards, not 35 for POA tests (point of aim) no closer. Then shoot 5 shots at the board or paper, each shot over the last, this will give you/him a true POI.

The above test will tell you what to do if anything. I'm sure Benelli has shims like Beretta , check that out next. Best of luck with these tests, I'm glad you are doing this as it will help him for sure.

Tom
 

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Get rid of the gun and get one that shoots straight. The reason I say this is because with his
eye lined up and looking down the center of the rib the gun shoots to the left. HMB
 

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Before you do anything, find out where the gun shoots.

13 yards from a rest, actually aim and squeeze the trigger. At least 2 shots, more if they do not impact at the same place.

Jason
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Thank you all for the advice!! There are some things here that I will try with him the next time we are at the gun club. He is a one eyed shooter now. Tried to get him to shoot with both and scores went down tremendously.
 

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Thee Old Churchill method of finding out where your POI is and how to OR what to do to correct it has been used by gunfitters for many years !
it goes like this , from 16 yds you move the comb or stock 1/16 '' to gain 3'' of pattern movement !

Try it and see !
 

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The rough formula shooting from 16 yards is move the stock 1/16 inch you get a 1 inch movement of the Point of Impact. This will equate to 2 inches at 32 yards.

The actual formula takes into account the distance of the bead from the eye and the actual distance (not sure if it is from the eye or end of barrel).

Jason
 

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Standing in a static position and shooting at an object doesn't give you good results particularly if you're not holding tightly onto your gun from the start of the mount to the end of the shot. As others have suggested have your son shoot the gun from something like a table or shooting bench resting the barrel on a bag of shot or some firm rest to confirm the gun it's self is shooting straight making several shots, if the muzzles end is close to the rest this will aid in keeping the shot on target. This procedure will confirm that choke is not throwing an off center pattern and its shooting straight. Have you son shoot the gun and then you or someone else to confirm where the gun is shooting.

The problem my be as simple as the butt placement as Tom Strunk has suggested which will aid in locking in the gun preventing it from drifting away from your sons face mid shot. Tom suggests 20 yards for pattern placement and I would be inclined to agree with him, Tom has a ton of experience when it comes to dialing in a gun and his advice is always sound.

Your son needs to understand that he must pull the gun and hold onto it firmly making one with him, this helps in preventing the greatest sin of allowing your arms to point the gun not the rotation of the body whether its from the waist or off the ankles.

Being a one eyed shooter, I would say if his eye over and straight down his barrel that the problem stems from not holding onto his gun and or letting his arms get involved when pointing his gun, although he may need some offset in the form of cast or comb shift and may be the cause he's not staying in the gun?

If can video him it should tell you a lot of what's going on.



Surfer
 

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Not only can Tron make you a better cast off shim he also may be able to make an adjustable recoil pad for the Benelli. I thought I read some where that he can make these for your type of gun. You should give him a call.
 

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A light gun like a Benelli that recoils a lot will always pattern to the left for a right hand shooter when shot at a stationary target. Before you start making changes, lock down the trap for straight -a-ways. See if he's shooting to the left of the target, or the breaks are on the left side of the target. If he's centering them, you don't have a problem.
 

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It is quite common for a right hand shooter to pull left upon execution of shot when shooting a stationary target. Put your boy on a solid rest when shooting the board for poi placement.
 

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All good advice above, but
In my case... It was not the gun, it was me.

Before you do anything, find out where the gun shoots.
13 yards from a rest, actually aim and squeeze the trigger. At least 2 shots, more if they do not impact at the same place.
It is quite common for a right hand shooter to pull left upon execution of shot when shooting a stationary target.
http://www.mn-trap.org/tech_corner/n_winston/Point_of_Impact_and_Pattern_Testing_at_13_Yards.pdf
 

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Generally good advice, except for getting rid of the gun!

I almost guarantee that this gun shoots straight, and the reason you pulled to the left is either 1)not enough cast in stock, resulting in mid bead being to the right of the front bead 2) or you pulled shot to the left. It would be an very usual occurrence for a quality gun to shoot this far off. The worse ones might be off 2-3 inches at 35 yards, but its very difficult to perceive that on a moving target, even for an expert.

There was a gentlemen at the club just last week, who was struggling on five stand. He took his gun(Browning XS) to the pattern board and fired a shot, and then came back shaking his head confident that he had found his problem. His pattern on paper was fully to the left at 20 yards-he hadn't even hit his aiming mark at all. I took the gun and fired a shot- it shot perfectly straight-he had just pulled it/flinched that badly.

I would recommend you check the straightness at 13 yards from a rest, and never patterning again. You just don't gain anything by looking at one or two patterns on paper, they are just too random. Any IM or full choke will perform more well enough to break any 16 yard target. Adjust stock so that without struggling the beads are aligned in a Figure 8 pattern, or with a flat shooting gun like a Benelli maybe just a small amount of space and you will be fine. Fine tune on the field, stop when you are hitting targets solidly.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Thank you all for the advice. Going to borrow a lead sled from a buddy of mine and have my son shoot the paper again. If everything checks out there will start working with my son on some of the other advice given. No big swings at it tho, don't want him to start regressing from where he is at right now.
 
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