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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I recently got this Winchester model 12 in trade and I don’t really know what it is I have.
Looking for anyone that can tell me what I have and what it might be worth.
I have taken it out shooting clay once and used steel ammo before I had looked it up and saw that some people said that may be dangerous or hurt the gun and it shot excellent but wanted to make sure it was okay to put steel shot through it
Thanks in advance for any info
I will try my best to answer any questions or add additional pics if needed













 

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From the serial # it was produced about 1929 see link below.

Stating the obvious, It looks to be a solid rib with a straight stock and black diamond inlet on the stock. That said, without more research or checking #'s on the wood, it's hard to determine if it's an original stock nor do I see a matching black diamond on the forearm. Recoil pad is not original.

These old M-12's are nice and yours looks to be in decent shape for it's age.

With regard to "worth" prices are all over the board and I'll defer to our resident M-12 experts.

 

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I am not a expert by any means. It appears you have a 1929 Black diamond Model 12 Tournament . I think if it is legit it will be stamped in the wood stock under the recoil pad Tournament Grade ? I am sure someone with a lot more info will respond.
 

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I'd recommend NO steel shot 'cause these guns have relatively thin barrels at the choke. At least that is what Briley told me 40 years ago when I was getting one choked with thin walls. Back then, almost the whole choke was threaded instead of just the end.

A "black diamond" model stock.
 

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Hello Streetsurfer33 and welcome to the forum. Your first post is exactly what this forum was created for.

I've got a very similar gun made in 1927 and also wondered what I had. I contained Scott Wagner, a well known Model 12 collector and he said I had a tournament gun. The Tournament gun was made to satisfy the desires of trapshooters from the mid 1920's according to some of the advertising. While they were not "Trap Grade," Winchester put some of their best wood them and your gun definitely has that.

My gun was in bad shape when I got it. It worked fine and the bore was spotless but it looked like it had spent its life cased in someone's car trunk. It had very little bluing on it but it really shot well for me. I'm sure I've broken more 25's with this gun than all my other guns put together. I nicknamed it the "Moneymaker." It likes the Winchester AA shells, one ounce of #8 lead shot. Don't shoot steel shot through it.

One day, while shooting, the forearm came off the action slide and I had to get it repaired. I sent it to Stu Wright and had his shop go completely through the gun. Here's what it looked like when it came back.

Enjoy shooting your treasure and come back to visit us on a regular basis.

Happy Thanksgiving!

Outdoor bench Plant Furniture Picnic table Table
 

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Don't shoot steel shot through it EVER.

If you want an expert opinion, I would suggest contacting Devon Harris who owns Seven Sections American Nostalgia. Devon specializes in Model 12 appraisals, repairs, and purchasing. His number is 574-722-4870.
Have a gunsmith check the choke constriction. It may have been
opened up. If it is a true full choke, no steel shot. If it is a modified,
I see no reason why you could not use steel shot.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
From the serial # it was produced about 1929 see link below.

Stating the obvious, It looks to be a solid rib with a straight stock and black diamond inlet on the stock. That said, without more research or checking #'s on the wood, it's hard to determine if it's an original stock nor do I see a matching black diamond on the forearm. Recoil pad is not original.

These old M-12's are nice and yours looks to be in decent shape for it's age.

With regard to "worth" prices are all over the board and I'll defer to our resident M-12 experts.

Thanks for all the info, even the basic info is helpful to me as I’m not as versed in the terms as I should be, I also do not see a black diamond mark on the forearm, does that mean the forearm has likely been replaced?
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
I am not a expert by any means. It appears you have a 1929 Black diamond Model 12 Tournament . I think if it is legit it will be stamped in the wood stock under the recoil pad Tournament Grade ? I am sure someone with a lot more info will respond.
Any idea how to remove the recoil pad? I don’t see any screw holes or slits? So I was thinking maybe it was epoxied on but wasn’t sure how to go about removing it without damaging anything
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
I'd recommend NO steel shot 'cause these guns have relatively thin barrels at the choke. At least that is what Briley told me 40 years ago when I was getting one choked with thin walls. Back then, almost the whole choke was threaded instead of just the end.

A "black diamond" model stock.
Don't shoot steel shot through it EVER.

If you want an expert opinion, I would suggest contacting Devon Harris who owns Seven Sections American Nostalgia. Devon specializes in Model 12 appraisals, repairs, and purchasing. His number is 574-722-4870.
Thanks for the referral I will definitely contact him and get his opinion
 

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The pad is probably held on by 2 screws, the holes in the pad have closed back up. Get a PH screwdriver and put some liquid dish soap on the tip and probe along the center line of the pad, you should find the holes and the screws.

Pat
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Hello Streetsurfer33 and welcome to the forum. Your first post is exactly what this forum was created for.

I've got a very similar gun made in 1927 and also wondered what I had. I contained Scott Wagner, a well known Model 12 collector and he said I had a tournament gun. The Tournament gun was made to satisfy the desires of trapshooters from the mid 1920's according to some of the advertising. While they were not "Trap Grade," Winchester put some of their best wood them and your gun definitely has that.

My gun was in bad shape when I got it. It worked fine and the bore was spotless but it looked like it had spent its life cased in someone's car trunk. It had very little bluing on it but it really shot well for me. I'm sure I've broken more 25's with this gun than all my other guns put together. I nicknamed it the "Moneymaker." It likes the Winchester AA shells, one ounce of #8 lead shot. Don't shoot steel shot through it.

One day, while shooting, the forearm came off the action slide and I had to get it repaired. I sent it to Stu Wright and had his shop go completely through the gun. Here's what it looked like when it came back.

Enjoy shooting your treasure and come back to visit us on a regular basis.

Happy Thanksgiving!

View attachment 1776433
Thanks for all the great info, I’m glad to know that there is another grade this gun fits into. When I first started researching I had heard that if it didn’t say trap on it then it wasn’t a black diamond model so I was assuming the stock had been switched out.
I just took it out with some friends to shoot clay in the woods but we were all impressed with how it shot and it became a favorite quickly.
And thank you for the ammo suggestion, now looking into steel vs lead shot I’m really not sure what I put threw it, the boxes don’t clearly say and I had just assumed they were steel, I do have some older boxes of Winchester AA so I will make sure to try those, I will try to add a picture but I also have Winchester super target that I believe to be lead that should be ok correct?
And your gun looks to be in great condition and very clean when it came back from the shop, you have me considering taking mine in now.
Thanks for the warm welcome also it’s very much appreciated
 

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Just drop a dime down the barrel from the chamber if it sticks @ muzzle its the full choke still there.
A nickel steel "Black Diamond" grade, too bad the checkering has been sanded while the diamonds are in good shape. Its just a shooter in its condition, restoration job would exceed value in my opinion, just replace the pad. As far as steel shot, what size for clays or waterfowl ? I shot steel in model 12's for # of years @ waterfowl with no damage or streaks in the barrel. If you need lesser choke reduce the constriction over Briley thin walls.
 
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