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I clicked the shooting info / programs box instead of the discussion box when I posted Sorry! Still Looking for some input on the possibilities of why a right handed shooter misses hard rights on post 4 and 5. Thanks to the ones who found it in the wrong place and replied.
 

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For a righhander, hard rights from post five seem to be faster than hard lefts from post one. Just the opposite seems to be the case for left handers.

I'm guessing it has something to do with transitioning from the left eye to the right eye as the clay travels across your field of vision. From post one a right hander uses primarily his right eye for hard lefts and doesn't seem to transition to the left eye. I don't know but I'm guessing eye transition has something to do with percieved speed.

If that's the case does anyone have any suggestions or techniques for slowing down hard rights?
 

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Try holding your gun towards the center of the house. This way you see the target for a longer period of time and you feel there is no rush to get to the target. remember there is no way 41 mph is going to outrun 650mph,

Phil Berkowitz
 

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Just a thought....I've found that many of my misses on hard right/ station 5 are because I shoot over the target (not behind as we so often assume). I've dropped my hold a bit and have seen improvement.

Remember that the bird is not traveling in a straight line to the right, but travels on an arc and starts to drop shortly after clearing the house. Watch a few birds and you'll see it. Another option would be to concentrate hard on the bottom of the bird...hard for me to do...my eyes aren't that good!!

Good luck,
Trail
 

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I have the same problem but I have the privilege to know Patricia Ryan who at one time was with Frank Little (never had the honor to meet the man & the best I heard)
I said to her one time about my hard right angles. She told me there are several factors that come into play: such as body type, short or long arms or necks, etc. in my case she thought I stayed in the gun well, had the gun over the house properly. She told me to widen my stance on position 4 & 5. To this day I still have to remind myself. Seems to help
 

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Forget trick holds or stances...work on fundamentals.

The next time you miss one of those bad boys, FREEZE!!! immediately after the shot...

Were you focused on the front of the target and was the image clear?

Is the butt pad still firmly in your shoulder pocket?

Check rib in relation to your eye. Is it still centered?

Is the stock still firmly against the side of your face?

Is your cheek still firmly down on the stock?

Swinging to the right is awkward for some right-handers and all kinds of weird things happen in the upper body because of it.

Keller
 

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I am no expert, I have the DVD's from all of the top dogs in this sport. The one thing in common is, it all starts at the ground. Foot positioning is more important than people give it credit.Now for me on post five, my feet are darn near in line with the apron I am so far cranked around to the right. My hold point like mentioned above is almost the center of the house and about the middle of the lid. Another thing that another shooter told me. A hard right from post five is the closest target you will shoot at, next to a hard left from post one. I used to be afraid of hard rights on post five.Now they are my favorite target to get. the straight aways make my knees shake though. One post one my feet are almost square to the front of the concrete. this way my body is free to swing to the left when the target comes out. Angled targets no longer bother me. My key thing is to check my feet position and then check again, and re-check before the first shot. once I have my feet planted. They do not move until I am done on that post. It all starts at the ground. This is what works for me, it may not work for you. We are all different. Do what works best for you.
 

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On the hard right, for a right handed shooter, if you use your arms to move the gun, (and you are not acting like a tank turret with complete upper body movement) you may be pulling the gun off of your cheek. This is why Keller is asking you to freeze after the shot, to see just what was happening with your mechanics.

When on 4 and 5, especially, make sure your right elbow is up.
Have a buddy place a one dollar bill between your cheek and the comb.
If the bill drops... you know what is happening...

He gets the bill and you miss the bird.

Nice training aid.

Art
 

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Good points. What works best for me is both feet at 90 degree line in the center of post 4 or 5; swing from the waist. It is paramount that you see this target immediately. Do not bring your eyes back to the gun. Also, make it your favorite target (attitude). BT100dc
 

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Lot of geat ideas so far. Here is one more. One day when you are practicing at your local club and things have slowed down, ask if you can have the machine locked to throw hard rights. This will give you a chance to try various foot positions and hold points to see which combination works best for you.
 

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<blockquote><I>"Have a buddy place a one dollar bill between your cheek and the comb. If the bill drops... you know what is happening..."</i></blockquote>Art, that's a great money maker for somebody, but a shooter can keep their cheek AGAINST the side of the stock and still lift their cheek bone straight up OFF THE COMB. It doesn't take much. I know... shooting with one eye as I do, if the target ever drops below my muzzle (a "wind dip") I way too likely to lift my head to find it.

Keller
 

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The possible reasons are numerous. Save yourself a lot of time and get someone who can see where you are shooting (people who have been coaching for years usually are good at it) tell you where you are missing and if there is something obviously wrong with your move/ posture.

The advice you get here would probably be a lot more help if you could say whether you are consistently offline low, or high, or behind, etc.
 

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<blockquote><I>"Position your right foot slightly back so you don't put your body in a bind."</i></blockquote>That may make rights on 5 a bit easier but it may also tie you up when you get a left (straightaway) from the same post. Ya gotta be able to swing both ways...

Keller
 

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Opinions, everyone has one. rotating from the waist would seem to cause as many problems as it solves, including a bad back. Move from the ankles up with the torso and upper body locked such that you remain locked in the gun by the back hand and from the hips up. The only movement alowed is the front hand to move the gun up to track verticle movement of the target.

Chuck
 

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I like the last post best, from Don

I am a pretty new shooter and went through all the suggestions and well meaning help that was offered for this target presentation

The thing that changed my score on these targets was the mind set and understanding what my sight picture needed to be in order to break it.

regardless of how I get there I know what it must be in order to break it I can every now and then still screw up the mechanics but correct it and break it because I know what it must look like


I still miss a few but I love the hard right because the sight picture is engrained into my visual memory and it now seems easy when I read the target

The thing that I still find myself doing when I miss is jumping because I dont see it right away and I rush the shot, swing past the target and then I slow the swing because I am to far in front of it or I have gotten over it.

Keep shooting it and shoot in front of it and it will start to make sense to your brain and your body what you need to see that trips the trigger. Practice good fundmentals of stance and turning square at the shoulders


There are no shortcuts, when it starts to ink ball for you come back and tell everyone because that ink ball is truly a thing of beauty in trap shooting
Good luck
 
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