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Discussion Starter #1
Hello:
This subject may be controversial, but let's try to have a good discussion about this matter without someone getting upset.

Before I start, I just want to say that I personally have the utmost respect for any trapshooter that has ever made it to the 27 yard line sometime in his career.

Recently, I ran into a couple friends of mine at a local restaurant and the subject came up "should it be mandatory for someone who has earned the 27 yard line to have his or her yardage reduced should their average fall below a certain point?

Two of us felt that you pay for your own targets and once you have earned the 27 yard line it's up to you to decide should you ever want to accept a yardage reduction. One of us felt, the yardage reduction should be mandatory on the basis why have someone mess up an entire squad with shooting abnormally low scores?

What is your opinion on this matter?
Steve Balistreri
Wauwatosa Wisconsin
 

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What's your definition of "mess up an entire squad"? If you mean a shooter shooting a lousy score is a distraction to the other shooters on the squad and causes the others on the squad to shoot poorly, I'm not sure that has much if any validity.
 

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I don't think reductions should be mandatory if you earned the yardage you should be able to refuse it at any yardage,average should definately not be the deciding factor in reductions anyway known abilty is seldom used in handicapping or classifying.....sandbagging or grown men shooting handicap from 18 yds should be a bigger issue than shooting at a yardage that you can't maintain a 90 average at.Jerry
 

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Tell your friends to worry about where they stand and mind their own business ... I have seen shooters on the 16 yardline break a score of 50 out of 100, the rest of the squad was almost perfect, so that eliminates any validity to them causing bad scores ... WPT ... (YAC) ...
 

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Everyone will shoot a low score at one time (or more) or another and by the same token they will shoot a score that is above their average.

If a low score messes up shooters on a squad they are paying attention to things that they shouldn't. They should be concentrating on their own shooting.
 

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I've never read a compelling reason for mandatory reductions. A such, I think they should be voluntary. Most of the 27 yarders I know shoot on handicap squads with the same people all the time. Some of them shoot really lousy scores, but stay there mostly because they want to shoot with their buddies. Also, there is some smuggery about being on the 27.

Some of these shooters did take reductions, or two, but none of them would accept a deduction that put them on the 24. They wouldn't be able to shoot with their buddies.
 

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It always amazes me that shooters who are not on the 27yd line are so concerned with 27 yard shooters taking reductions,.....
My opinion is that if you spent the time and money,. and put in the work to make it to the 27 yard line,..... you have earned the right to shoot there whether you shoot above the reduction average or below it,..... It's your targets,... your money,..... As jdsfarms says, sandbagging or grown men shooting handicap from 18 yds should be a bigger issue than shooting at a yardage that you can't maintain a 90 average at.

R
 

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Maybe the discussion should be proposed from a different perspective and I say this having refused the recently enacted 2-yard reduction and I'm at 21 yards...

Is my earned yardage really "mine"? If we take the perpective that earned yardage belongs to the ATA member, then the answer belongs solely to the trapshooter...

However if the consensus is other and the ATA unilaterally chose to require reductions, what would the rank and file do about it?! Right now the ATA allows a refusal, but the BOD does have the ability to change the rules.

Respectfully offered,

j.
 

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Steve,
If yardage and class is truly based on score/performance then perhaps as the score/performance goes up or down then everything else should follow?? Larry
 

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I could never vote to employ mandatory reductions back when the topic would periodically be disgusted. It is the shooters money that's being spent. No one else other than possibly a spouse or parent is responsible for entry fee payments. Therefore in my opinion it is their right to stay there.

As for messing up a squad, most of the 27 yd. folks shoot with their friends. As such, no one involuntarily is forced to be part of any distraction. Also, the ones that would state such are most likely affected by birds, bees, fly's, nats and a host of creatures and vegetation always common on the firing line.


Flip side however is designed on the taking of yardage reductions when earned.
 

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There should be no one shooting below the 25 yd line....better yet would be to put everyone on the 27 and then base a shooter's "handicap" in the manner that golf does....

Everybody gets to shoot with their buddies...the only thing that changes us the final scores....

Pretty simple procedure ..... But then again, we are talking about the ATA......

Curt
 

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I like your idea Curt, but I'd split it two only two distances, 23 and 27 yard. Makes squading easy and saves a lot of time and wear and tear on the equipment.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
Some of you make a lot of sense. I will tell you what happened to me years ago. I was on the 25 yard line shooting with a 26 and 3 27 yard shooters. The 3 27 yard shooters were well known shooters and had 1 score of 88, 1 score of 91, and 1 score of 94.

I got a bit nervous and shoot a 76 that day. After we shot the 26 yard shooter came up to me and said that I F---ed up his shooting royally with all my misses, as he shot a score of 84.

I did not really know the 26 yard shooter personally but told him to worry about his own targets and not look for excuses when you have a bad day. He said my loses screwed up his timing.

Now getting back to my original thread, one of my friends was a 27 yard shooter years ago. One day an older senior veteran shooter shot on his squad and he posted a score of 68.

This shooter refused all his reductions and should have been shooting around the 23 yard line. In fact years ago, I don't really know if the rule has changed, but if you were once a 27 yard shooter you could not go back to 23 yards? If someone knows the actual ruling please let me know. Well my friend and some of the other 27 yard shooters bit--ed and moaned over this guy shooting at 27 yards.
Steve
 

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Steve,

Someone who is blaming your shooting for messing up his shooting is looking for an excuse.

That unless when he called for his target you ran over to him and pulled the trigger!
 
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