Well in the last 3 weeks there have been 400 union jobs lost in my area. A national company just closed Friday and 75 lost their jobs . Monday morning a new company was hireing workers. $10 less an hour .Union workers are 10% now .By May there wont be 1%. If you are a union worker and the union agrees to what the company offers WHY would you pay union dues? rick
labor unions going fast
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Why pay union dues?My dues were 60 dollars a month for twenty years.Im 42 years old collecting my pension.The company paid 100 percent of the contributions to my pension.Not like most companies that have a non matching 401 k and use YOUR money and call it their pension plan.Well worth 60 dollars per month when I bring home the extra 5-6 percent of my pay for twenty years not contributing to a 401 k........Don
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Don, Do you mind me asking what union,or work you did. I'm considerably older and have employed union tradesmen for over 30 years. None of our people were able to retire until their early 60's, one I remember mid 50's. You have been very fortunate, but I think a rare exeption to the norm. Shoot well and have fun, Bob
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Bob I am a member of Teamsters local 701 North Brunswick NJ.We were very fortunate to invest our pension wisely as all members stayed involved with the fund.It is a rarety in the Teamsters to go at 20 years our local being the exception.Most locals are 25 years at 55 or 30 years any age.Shoot well......Don
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Don, I was always a fan of Jimmy Hoffa Sr. He did an incedible amount of good for the truck driver's of this country. You made me go upstairs and see what our carpenters are paying for dues. I knew it was a lot, 58.40 per week, that's over 3,000 per year. Our benefit package is over 24 per hour, that's benefits only, no insurance, overhead, or profit left for the company. I don't know how we remain in business. As a small business owner I am scared to death of what's coming at us this next year. We as a country are looking at the most difficult financial times of our lifetime still ahead of us. Unfortunately I believe our political leaders are clueless, but I know they can't get anymore blood from this stone. Shoot well and often while we can, Bob
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The unions were a great thing and made things right for those that were getting screwed. I believe that times have changed and unions are becoming an obsolete concept. Either a major revamp is needed or they will begin to fade away. The market is now very global and extremely competitive, this makes it very difficult for a union based employer to compete, when his labor costs are higher than the competitor. I would rather see the loss of the union wage than the company moving their plant to Mexico or Canada.
No offense to thos of you that union workers and thanks for your service, just my 2 cents.
Cheers,
SMK
No offense to thos of you that union workers and thanks for your service, just my 2 cents.
Cheers,
SMK
I think its time that the people stop expecting Unions or government to take care of us. They are going to take care of themselves only. People need to wake up and start getting those greedy money hungry immoral, unethical,schemen assholes out of government and get in fresh new people with some ethics and honesty. If the don't show it the throw them out and put in more. This is what its going to take. Everyone in government now has made a carrier out of it. Gee look at the Jessie Jackson what the hell are people thinking.
Its obvious what the Clintons will sell you down the drain. Nobama and the Clintons more or less dictate what the media is going to say. Wake up. B12
Its obvious what the Clintons will sell you down the drain. Nobama and the Clintons more or less dictate what the media is going to say. Wake up. B12
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644 Posts
Another factor for your consideration.
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Bob building trades packages have always been high.I dont know how u do it.Their dues are on a percentage of earnigs and cost a member alot.Our package is an hourly rate for the first 40 hours only.Last full year I worked I had 950 hours overtime.Its cheaper the company found out to work two men 20 hours ot then to hire another fulltime employee because of benefits, vacation,sick, personal days etc......Don
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Most unionists blame Ron Reagan on the demise. Remember the Air Traffic Controllers Strike? Ever since then unions have taken a hit. The United Steel workers were at such a low membership that the accepted the United Rubber Workers in to the fold, in the '80s I think it was. My wife's uncle was the International Safety Committeeman for the USW International. He was a raving radical and probably caused many a company to close single handedly. "Companies only hire the dumbest people they can find so they can take advantage of them", was his standby.
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Some unions are good, some not so good. Even down to some locals are better than others.
One of the most important things is where is the money for your retirement? General Motors Boyz kept it in the company so they could play with it, too bad. I believe Ford retirement money is separated from company finances, that's better.
boils down to caveat emptor.
HM
One of the most important things is where is the money for your retirement? General Motors Boyz kept it in the company so they could play with it, too bad. I believe Ford retirement money is separated from company finances, that's better.
boils down to caveat emptor.
HM
"9/7/08
UAW squanders dues on golf resort
United Auto Workers' golf course losing millions
Down a lonely country road far from the interstate hangs a banner at the UAW's golf course: "Public welcome." But a review of the golf course and adjacent education center's financial statements indicate that not enough people have been visiting.
The UAW International's golf course and education center operations on 1,000 acres near Onaway have together lost $23 million over the past five years, independent audits obtained by the Free Press show. Both are run as for-profit corporations, according to paperwork filed with the U.S. Department of Labor, and the UAW has been propping them up with loans.
"There's a lot of debate over what to do," said Arthur Wheaton, a union expert from Cornell University. "They've been having trouble there trying to get enough people to go through there to justify the expense," he added.
The facilities are reminders of another time when the autoworkers' union was flush with dues-paying members. But now the U.S. auto industry is losing money, the UAW is losing members and some people are questioning the need to keep the money-losing operations.
The UAW and others defend the properties as important assets and point out that President Ron Gettelfinger has been aggressive about cutting costs to protect the union's financial health.
While the UAW International has a huge reserve of money, the union filed financial records with the federal government stating that it spent about $2.7 million more than it took in during 2007 -- the third time over the past five years that the union spending exceeded receipts, records show.
"All you have to do is look at the membership trends and realize that there was a golden age when they could easily support the education center," said Hal Stack, director of the Labor Studies Center at Wayne State University.
"It could be that either things turn around or they sell it," he added.
From a peak of 1.5 million members in the 1970s, the UAW ranks have dropped to just 465,000 regular members, according to its most recent federal filings.
In 2007 the UAW had receipts -- union dues, fees and other income -- of $327.6 million and it spent $330.3 million. While losing members, the UAW International, since at least 2000, has been able to hold fairly steady in the amount of money it brings in and spends, according to federal records. It has $1.2 billion in net assets."
UAW squanders dues on golf resort
United Auto Workers' golf course losing millions
Down a lonely country road far from the interstate hangs a banner at the UAW's golf course: "Public welcome." But a review of the golf course and adjacent education center's financial statements indicate that not enough people have been visiting.
The UAW International's golf course and education center operations on 1,000 acres near Onaway have together lost $23 million over the past five years, independent audits obtained by the Free Press show. Both are run as for-profit corporations, according to paperwork filed with the U.S. Department of Labor, and the UAW has been propping them up with loans.
"There's a lot of debate over what to do," said Arthur Wheaton, a union expert from Cornell University. "They've been having trouble there trying to get enough people to go through there to justify the expense," he added.
The facilities are reminders of another time when the autoworkers' union was flush with dues-paying members. But now the U.S. auto industry is losing money, the UAW is losing members and some people are questioning the need to keep the money-losing operations.
The UAW and others defend the properties as important assets and point out that President Ron Gettelfinger has been aggressive about cutting costs to protect the union's financial health.
While the UAW International has a huge reserve of money, the union filed financial records with the federal government stating that it spent about $2.7 million more than it took in during 2007 -- the third time over the past five years that the union spending exceeded receipts, records show.
"All you have to do is look at the membership trends and realize that there was a golden age when they could easily support the education center," said Hal Stack, director of the Labor Studies Center at Wayne State University.
"It could be that either things turn around or they sell it," he added.
From a peak of 1.5 million members in the 1970s, the UAW ranks have dropped to just 465,000 regular members, according to its most recent federal filings.
In 2007 the UAW had receipts -- union dues, fees and other income -- of $327.6 million and it spent $330.3 million. While losing members, the UAW International, since at least 2000, has been able to hold fairly steady in the amount of money it brings in and spends, according to federal records. It has $1.2 billion in net assets."
I hired in at Inland Steel in 1976, I retired from Inland/Mittal Steel in 2006. Started at age 18 and pulled the plug at 48, so I was a dues paying member of the USWA for 30 years. Now I am back in school doing what I should have done at 18. One thing that perplexes me is when I graduate Nursing School with a BS/Nursing degree i can expect to start out making $22-23 per hour. In the mill I was making $10.00 more than that. Hummm dosent make any sense to me. As a RN the responsibility I can expect is enormus and the pay should reflect that. And as I have been on both sides of the fence Nursing is a much tougher job.
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In the long term picture. There's no room for collective bargaining in a two class system with a one world government. Either your a have or a have not, it's what that system is all about and it's headed your way soon. We're losing the America we love a step at a time and when we no longer have unions, we'll work for whatever they offer? I wonder what that might be on a global scale? Hap
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WE don't need no Unions, let's let every man make his own deal. I bet I can work cheaper, work harder, more hours and weekends than anyone else. I wouldn't even charge overtime and I don't need a lunch break, my cusins even cheaper cause he lives with me for free.
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I'm going to try to not get personal here, but Don up there is the prime example of why the Unions are in deep shit. Started at 20 (roughly) retired drawing a pension at 40 (roughly). If Don is like most people, he can expect to live to approx. 80. Wonderful system -- work for 20 years, be retired for 40 and drawing a pension.
Sounds to me like it's the UNION killing the UNION.
If Don started with $1000 in a union kitty, paid $3000 a year in union dues for 20 years, and if those dues made 6% annually compounded, Don still only put in $120,000. How in the hell does the union expect to pay Don for 40 years when he only contributed $120K WITH COMPOUNDING. Answer: it can't. It uses current dues to pay current retirees.
Again, it's the UNION killing the UNION.
In the 60s,, you had more workers than retirees. Therefore, lots of cash. Now, it's backwards, and the unions are just as happy to bring the whole company down around with them into the abyss.
Difference between a union and the mafia? Nothing. Take "labor" out of the definition of a union, and you have the definition of organized crime.
The cold hard truth is Unions have to change their ways. Retirement after 20 years is no longer an option. Retirement is age 65. If that means you put in 45 years on the job then the retirees thank you for your service.
Sounds to me like it's the UNION killing the UNION.
If Don started with $1000 in a union kitty, paid $3000 a year in union dues for 20 years, and if those dues made 6% annually compounded, Don still only put in $120,000. How in the hell does the union expect to pay Don for 40 years when he only contributed $120K WITH COMPOUNDING. Answer: it can't. It uses current dues to pay current retirees.
Again, it's the UNION killing the UNION.
In the 60s,, you had more workers than retirees. Therefore, lots of cash. Now, it's backwards, and the unions are just as happy to bring the whole company down around with them into the abyss.
Difference between a union and the mafia? Nothing. Take "labor" out of the definition of a union, and you have the definition of organized crime.
The cold hard truth is Unions have to change their ways. Retirement after 20 years is no longer an option. Retirement is age 65. If that means you put in 45 years on the job then the retirees thank you for your service.
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61 Posts
I'm one of those who think unions are/were a good thing. directly or indirectly unions have improved the non-union workers lot. I'm also one of those who think a union has to go if that union negatively impacts the profitability of a company. That is when a union instead of being a good thing for all becomes a parasite that kills its host. A long time ago I worked for a company where the management sent the union a contract with slightly better wage increases than the previous contract and a moderate increase in the cost of health benefits. Management also added a bonus to every worker if the contract was signed. Guess what? The union went out on for two months and eventually signed a contract that was slightly worse than the original and no bonus. The end result was several very large orders were canceled as a direct result of the strike. The loss of these orders caused a layoff of 15% of the workers and two years later the company was in chapter 7 with everyone out of a job. I see the UAW and the big three in a similar situation and I feel sorry for all those who will lose their jobs, health care and retirement benefits because of all the pigheadedness on both sides. I don't want the big three to go out of business, but if the UAW doesn't stop being a parasite and realize that, for now, they have to make big sacrifices to keep the companies in business and workers employed.
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