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Discussion Starter #1
Should a multi-discipline shotgun club, run by state government, funded by taxpayer's money, direct brand new shooters to only one of the disciplines and ignore the others?
 

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Barry:

No disrespect intended but...

I don't know what "multi-discipline shotgun club" you are referring to. Regardless, a better question would be something like, "Why is a state government running ANY gun club of ANY kind and why on earth would they be funding it with taxpayer money?"

Your state had a 13 billion dollar deficit last year. Stated another way, your state spent two dollars for every dollar of revenue in fiscal year 2010.

Your state is now six weeks into fiscal 2011. No serious budget has been proposed much less approved. The chickensh!ts in the General Assembly have once again abdicted THEIR constitutional responsibility by booting the budget question to your feckless governor. He and they continue to dither while refusing to make any decision or take any public position until after the November elections. There is absolutely no evidence to suggest any of them intend to make meaningful budget cuts and any new taxes are guaranteed to kill jobs and dig a deeper recessionary hole.

My point?? There's a 13 billion dollar deficit in your state because it meddles in countless big dollar boondoggles outside the realm of responsible governmental.

Which shotgun discipline(s) a state operated and funded facility promotes or doesn't begs the real question.

sissy
 

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Barry:

Could you provide a bit more information...

Jay
 

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Taxpayer funds should not be used to funnel impressionable newbies into the skeet lifestyle.


If they want to shoot skeet at the YMCA, that's their business...but I think there should be a 24-hour wait and parental notification.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Let me clear things up by putting it in a narrative.

Newby shooter comes in to a government run shotgun club and asks about shooting. Management tells them that they have sporting clays, trap, skeet and bunker but sporting clays is the best place to start, rents them the guns and sends them to the course.
 

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Sounds like the management got it right! Besides where are you going to direct a new shooter to get the maximum amount of $$ out of him?

ss
 

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Barry, You could also step forward and offer to take the "newbie" on a brief tour of the facility explaining the different shooting sports and see if they would like to have you shoot a round or two with them to help them get started. It can be enjoyable for both parties. Bob
 

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The State in question should do like they do out here with Ben Avery, its run by and funded by Arizona Game and Fish not the tax payers and that seems to work out pretty well ... Run by the State and funded with Tax payers money, which club would that be Barry ..? WPT ... (YAC) ...
 

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Discussion Starter #11
That's all well and good and I do my bit to promote trapshooting there since it is my passion. If it were me I would have a package of all of them. I think you would make more net profit doing this than just sending them out on the sporting clays course.

Trap's going to have the highest net profit than any of the others, by far, so the sporting clays course is the worse for that aspect.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
WPT. It makes no difference as to where it is. I think the practice is unfair to the taxpayers and, especially, the shooters.

Ben Avery is a State funded facility. It does not stand alone. Arizona Game and Fish is not a private business but a government agency. Don't confuse the issue with an attack on just one gun club.
 

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Arizona Game and Fish does not operate on taxpayers money, it operates on the income generated within itself ... Just so You don't confuse whats real with whats not because you have made a claim much like this before and were proved to be wrong ... Though you think the practice is unfair it seems to be working for this mystical club that without a name nobody can verify ... You cannot tell a business how to operate and how to function when in fact it must be doing something right even if you personally don't like it ... I recall you making a claim that your tax dollars were supporting Ben Avery and nothing would be further from the truth and I can prove it because there is no Barry and or Kim Roach on the Tax rolls in this state, I checked the records ... We like Arizona just the way it is, if you don't thats your problem go to Florida ... WPT ... (YAC) ...
 

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The county owned facility that I go to has skeet, trap, and 5 stand. When a new shooter comes in and asked what to shoot they point out the window where they have both games going on and let the customer choose. They never say 5 stand and I can't even believe that someone would send a newbie to sporting as it is harder than any of the other games.
 

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Many clubs see skeet 5 stand and sporting clays as the salvation of there problems only to find they create many more problems. They Disrespect the trapshooters who built these clubs and where did the money come from. Who bought the land where did the charters and bi-laws come from Do not forget what got you there or it will cost you
 

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I can't believe that Arizona Game and Fish, or any State Game and Fish department can charge enough for liscenses and fines to pay for their operation, I'm sure that it helps, but I can't believe that they are not funded with taxpayers dollars. Jim Butler
 

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A new shooter comes in, guy at the desk is reading his Playboy, rents the new shooter a gun, sells him some ammo, collects $ 28 for a round of sporting clays, and sends him on his way. Gone for a couple hours. Goes back to reading his Playboy.


You think he gives two S's whether the guy shoots sporting clays, trap, or skeet? Come on!
 

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The county run shooting center here in Westchester County New York has archery, pistol, rifle, skeet, trap, and international trap. After shooting here for about six months: I can honestly say that the staff is not partial to any discipline. The fees are a bit pricey, but they are open reular hours, and everyone is welcome.
 

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Doesn't take much imagination to figure out he's talking about Sparta.
Newbie shows up, probably has hunted some, would like to shoot better. It's obvious that he will feel more at home on a sporting course, shooting his hunting gun, or something like it, at targets he can identify with. He's going to have more fun, and spend more money, than on trap or skeet.
 

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IF Barry Roach is referring to an Illinois club, being newbies could lead to a few more issues: age, FOID Card, possible necessary supervision even with FOID etc.
 
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