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Discussion Starter #1
I have read some old threads on this subject and am curious to know if anyone loads a recipe close to this: STS or AA hulls with 17.3 clays fig 8 wads and Fiocchi 616 primer 1-1/8 #8. Any info?
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Lead Shot 12 1 1/8 oz. Clays Rem. 209P Rem. Fig. 8 19.2 9,000 LUP 1200 fps.

vs.

Lead Shot 12 1 1/8 oz. Clays Fio. 616 Rem. Fig. 8 17 10,500 PSI 1145 fps.

That seems like a big difference! That is why I am asking.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Those above recipes are straight off of the Hodgdon website! The pressure is crazy different. If I followed the Rem 209 recipe with what it calls for with a Fio 616 it would be a bomb!
 

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In my experience The Rem primers can take about a grain to a grain and a half more powder, all else being equal.

They are just kind of a slow starter........like me.

HM
 

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For me, I'd NEVER load 1 1/8 oz loads with Clays. EVER. For me, Clays is an 1 oz powder. Getting 1 1/8 up to 1200 is at the high end of its safety zone and I do not like loading shotgun shells there.

For 1 1/8 oz loads it is Green Dot all the way.
 

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Number one, swapping primers is a crapshoot. If you have reliable data for the Fiocchi, why are you asking this question? Clays is not a good choice for heavy 1 1/8 oz loads in Winchester or Remington hulls. Call Hodgdon and get their take on it. Clays is fine for 1oz loads or lighter 1 1/8oz. It hits the wall pretty quickly, pressure wise. I don't load target loads to over 10,000 PSI. If I want 1200 fps 1 1/8 oz loads, there are way more suitable powders available. Green Dot and American Select come to mind. I also don't care for the Fiocchi 616 primer. I've had some of the most inconsistant loads using them, especially in colder weather.
 

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I can second the cold weather lack of performance. Perhaps I will try the 617, I hear it is a bit hotter. In nomral weather I have no issues and am using anywehere from 16.6 of Clays with 12WAASL wad for 1 oz to 17.5 or so with Windjammer (downrange orange) for 1 1/8. I have not loaded any of the 19 grain stuff as we only shoot 16's and doubles in winter.
 

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Red Dot with the same drop works fine also. I've shot and reloaded about 3200 shell with the Fiocchi 616's. Bought them when the Winchesters were hard to find. Not one fail to fire or blooper. I bought a case of them so I have many more to reload and shoot, don't anticipate any issues.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
I have talked with Hodgdon, and Alliant about the replacement of the Win 209 primer with Fio 616! They both have assured me that these primers will swap out without any change to my recipe. Dont understand why someone would print all of the recipe guides to show such high pressures with the Fio 616 if they are a true even swap. Still a little hesitant to load a recipe with the same grains I am currently loading with the Fio 616??? Just a little confused!
 

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Pull-it!

When in doubt, assemble some and send them out for pressure and velocity testing. That way you will have real data to go by and not an opinion or guess.
 

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for target loads I have swapped Fio 616 with Win209 back and forth and never had a problem. I only ever swapped them when loading 21 or less of Green Dot, never tried with other powders.
 
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