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It looks like we will have another Olympics without an American Trap shooter. Very simply none of out shooters shot well enough to get in the finals. Anthony Matarese cam close as he was involved in that marathon shoot off for 6th place. Olympic trap has gotten tougher and we have not kept pace. We need more bunkers in this country so we can develop more shooters.

T
 

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RE: 14 person shoot-offScores are slowly raising.

I've heard it kicked around that no more two shots at a target in the run-up to the finals, but hard to change tradition.

RE: Also, they mentioned that the night before, a female shooter was Disqualified after an ammunition weight check found that her shell was over the 24 gram limit. There was a lot of drama because she was blaming the factory for the mistake.

Who would you blame as their not shooting reloads?
 

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Elena Tkach was shooting RC nickel and they were declared over weight. Who do you blame if not the factory? Perhaps the competitors need to have ammo checked and sealed before the competition.
Also, failure to disqualify her before the final deprived another competitor the chance to be in the final.
 

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Anthony Matarese was the highest placing American after shooting 122/125, missing the marathon shootoff which was comprised of those shooting 123. There was one perfect 125 shot, three 124's, and twelve 123's shooting for the final two places. After the countback process, Anthony would finish in 28th place, Myles Walker would finish in 57th with 119, and Jake Wallace would finish in 95th with a 115.

The United States will have one last try at a quota spot at the ISSF World Championships in Lonato, Italy beginning September 11th. The men have not filled either of their two possibile slots, and the women have filled only one.
 

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we simply don't currently have a Vincent Hancock or Kim Rhode shooting for us in Men's Olympic Trap.
That,s right, but the bunker is way different than skeet and double trap, whre you get the same presentations over and over again and you can practice all day long on them burning tones of shells From this point of view, the Americans are unmatched considering the volume of shells they use in trainig....and the results are there , Kim, Vincent, Jeff, Glenn etc
Bunker is umpredictible to a cetain point and the 9 schemes are impossible to be learn!!
If technically , physically and mentally you are not setup correctly for bunker there are no half mesurement to save your ass!
This is why I repeat allways to work with a professional until the Olympic gold medal is hanging around your neck!!



We need more bunkers in this country so we can develop more shooters.
Yes, we need bunkers and are plenty in USA used under their potential,due to lack of bunker coaches

B/c of that, in a couple of years the bunkers get close or are kept in conservation for better times

Croatia has ONE bunker and 3 of its shooters, including the 2012 Olympic gold medalist , shot 123/125 at the Gabala WC.

Unfortunatelly the male jr team did not made the final at the JR Wold Cup in Shul Ger. this year ,either!

Building bunkers will not make the difference unless you put a qualified coach on each of them.

...and you know I,m right!

Bill
 

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Pufftarget. I was shooting in Italy in June when someone made the comment that the RC4 Redshot ammo I was shooting was overweight. It appears that the Italians knew the ammo was overweight long before this shoot. Could it be like the Colts who knew about the under inflated balls at New England and waited till it could do some damage. Very Interesting.....

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Bill: Croatia is 1/8 the size of CALIFORNIA and we have only 5 locations. Also, your shooter can be at numerous and better locations in Europe in a fraction of the time that most of us in the U.S. can. If you simply look at the opportunities your Olympian had prior to London and since to shoot in meaningful matches as well as world cups it dwarfs the resume of any of our current shooters. However, if you look back at such as Josh Lakatos and Lance Bade and their resumes they were two of the best in the world. Only Josh had a true coach and largely at the beginning. Lance did not.

I would argue that there are many obstacles to our shooters doing well internationally equally as important as coaching, and until we can resolve these shortcomings we will continue to struggle in bunker.
 

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Yes, it would seem that Alexei Alipov was exempted from the rules for this shoot.
Why would you think he was exempted from the rules? Wasn't this a shoot, shot under the ISSF rules.


9.2.7 Eye And Ear Protection
a) All athletes and other persons in the vicinity of the firing line are urged to wear ear plugs, ear muffs, or similar adequate ear protection;
b) Ear protectors incorporating any type of radio receiving device are not permitted; and
c) All athletes, Referees and officials are urged to wear shatterproof shooting glasses or similar eye protection.
 

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I was referring to an incident in which - apparently- Mr. Alipov fired twice at a target and missed it. The flanking referees indicated he missed it and the head referee called it lost. Mr. Alipov seemingly accepted this verdict and the next shooter called for his target and shot. Then, as the next shooter was about to call, Mr. Alipov called the referee over and explained that the target he missed was the result of a slow pull. Unbelievably, the referee (who is Russian), backed the computer up two stations and allowed Mr. Alipov to shoot his target again.

There is so much wrong with this I don't know where to begin.
 

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Puff the point is that a small country like Croatia can produce 3-4 World level shooters if the training and the management is right!

The problem in the USA is that is no future after Jr Olympics for many great talents and that.s a big waste of human talent!

You don,t need more bunkers unless the demand is high, just take care of those who are exceptional .Period

Camps, clinics and other form of bunker instruction won,t work on a long run for many reasons

Lets not go so far, what are doing the bunker residents of USA shooting and of the Army who can,t complaine b/c the lack of shells and
targets ??

All those guys get plenty of talent so what is missing they just can,t get a quota place for the Olympics?

They have more than anybody else on the face of the Earth

I tell you that they are inocent and hard working people, but for bunker is not enough!!

Unfortunatelly they don,t have what they need most... a real bunker coach to train them right!!

I will not name but I can tell you that a lot of Army talented shooters get stocked and reach a low plateau b/c nobody was there to take them out!

If the Army or the USA shooting skeet or double trap shooter can take a flat and shoot 250 shells on a station the trap guy can,t do that b/c he changes

everything from the bunker routine. You can,t practice separate presentations b/c is not the same like you practice for skeet!

Considering that, the trap shooter needs a close person to chat with if something is going wrong.

The more the shooter is kept on the right track by the coach more the correct fundamentals are implemented.

Beside the technical part of the trainig many other elements need to be trained to get the whole thing.

Lets hope that the last tournament, the World in Italy will bring satisfaction of having at least a bunker shooters in the Olympics!

Bill
 

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Bil .... A couple of questions.

How many ATA ranges are in Croatia? I suspect there are none.

How many Sporting Clays Courses do they have? Again I suspect there are none.

My point is that Bunker trap is the only game in town plus this is probably a government run program that requires total commitment or its the gulag. No wonder they have good shooters.

T
 

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Late to the party yet again, Bill...
 

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Sorry being late...

Just take care properly of those shooting the JR Olympics and the USA will be at top of the World. The problem is that after 16 years of US experience

and now I am sure,there is NO ONE in US that can handle the situation. ...and the only hope is to surface an other Kim or Vincent but in bunker thatwill never ever happen without the help of a qualified coach!!

This is why the bunker is the king of the games!

.. and Tom I asure you that nobody has the training conditions better than the USA shooting and the Army( from public funding) and the results are next to O considering the qualification for the Olympics!

Finding all kind of excuses just prolonge the agony!!

Bill
 

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Bill.... You are like some of the politicians running for President..... Dodging the question.

Please answer my questions as stated above....

T
 

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Tom whats your point??

ATA and Bunker can,t be on the same page. Period.

One is recreational the other one is high performance.

We are talking about bunker not ATA.

But if you oppened the discution let me tell you that Croatia has no more than maybe 10 bunker shooters from which at leat 4 are world level shooters compared with the USA , with at least 150 registered , competitive.

ATA is a good starting point for bunker that many other countried don,t have.

As I said, bunker is not for everyone but if a 10 years old shoots 99 in ATA what is his motivation to stay with ATA??

The next level would be the bunker and many get stocked there b/c is an other animal!

I got you , b/c the diversity of clay games in USA, the bunker is short of shooters!!???

Of course is short b/c is hard and discourage people :

Only dedicated people try it hard to the point of quiting it b/c of lack of satisfaction.

You know better than anybody else that bunker can,t be self thought and the outcome is mediocrity!

Till there are not people to teach the bunker correctly , forget performance!

Bill
 

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My point is that in many countries Bunker is the only game and if you want to shoot clay target you shoot bunker period. There are no other sports siphoning off talent. You come from the eastern bloc where people shoot only for Olympic medals or they don't shoot period. In many cases poor performance leads to dire consequences. Things are not that way in America. As far as facilities I don't agree. I shot in Italy in June and our facilities are cess pools in comparisons.

I don't know what the answer is but more bunkers I know will help. I agree with you that a closed bunker gathers no shooters. I disagree with you regarding the recreational shooter. We who shoot it recreationally are the ones that supply the money to build and keep the bunkers open.


T
 
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