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I have Phil Kiner's article in “Trap & Field” from 2007, “For the Ladies Only, or so You Thought” regarding cross-firing. It would still be under copyright, but if Bro. Kiner would please give permission, I'll post it.
 
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...To suggest that those shooters would have been better if they'd shot 2 eyed is disrespectful...
I wouldn't call it disrespectful. I'd call it unprovable. To prove his point they'd have to adopt his method and shoot better than they ever did with one eye or some type of covering like tape, etc. I believe he has seen examples of that in his own coaching - with other shooters, not the ones named. And with enough of that experience, he is confident in his general statement. I've not seen his results first hand, but I do know, I've been doing better, so I'm going to go with his technique. I don't coach anybody, so I'm pretty much out of that end of the argument. I really like what his technique is doing for me, particularly the subconscious part. When I do it with no conscious reference to the barrel, man, it feels so good. That target is smoked, now. So I'm in. Have you tried it? No, and I don't think you will. You're convinced otherwise. And that's ok. But I won't be taking any more clinics from coaches that patch eyes and deal with what I had in the way you are promoting. Nope, been there, done that. This shooter is moving on. It just feels so right and good.

And thanks for your note. It was very clear and fair. I do appreciate the back and forth on this. It's how people resolve things for themselves.
 

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I wouldn't call it disrespectful. I'd call it unprovable. To prove his point they'd have to adopt his method and shoot better than they ever did with one eye or some type of covering like tape, etc. .
How do you or FNF know that they didn't try two eyed? I know the answer to that for two Olympic medalists. Does he?

Secondly, it isn't unprovable from my perspective. I don't have to prove anything. Deserie and Suzy won medals, world titles and many other things. My case rests.

FNF is the one asserting errors and ignorance. It is up to him top PROVE that they would have shot better two eyed. And he can't.
 

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How do you or FNF know that they didn't try two eyed? I know the answer to that for two Olympic medalists. Does he?

Secondly, it isn't unprovable from my perspective. I don't have to prove anything. Deserie and Suzy won medals, world titles and many other things. My case rests.

FNF is the one asserting errors and ignorance. It is up to him top PROVE that they would have shot better two eyed. And he can't.
I tried it. I liked it. I will continue.

I shot the second best wobble score with it last night at our local club. I have room to improve, so I will be back with some very strong interest.

Pull. Eyes on the target. Stay on the target, move and shoot. No peeking at the barrel to any degree. Let the "quick" part of your brain pick the correct eye's view and shoot the thing. Do it aggressively. Do it now.
 

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How do you or FNF know that they didn't try two eyed? I know the answer to that for two Olympic medalists. Does he?

Secondly, it isn't unprovable from my perspective. I don't have to prove anything. Deserie and Suzy won medals, world titles and many other things. My case rests.

FNF is the one asserting errors and ignorance. It is up to him top PROVE that they would have shot better two eyed. And he can't.
I really only know Sandra through Facebook but I do know Nora. What Nora did/does is what was discovered was required/necessary.

I doubt F&F knows of either their history and what either has achieved.
 

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The idea that FNF's "Pull. Eyes on the target. Stay on the target, move and shoot. No peeking at the barrel to any degree." is a new revelation is just silly.

Rolla Heikes “Concentrate your mind on the bird, and do not allow anything else to attract your attention.”

Frederick Oliver Robinson, Earl de Grey, after 1909 the Second Marquess of Ripon (1852-1923) “Never check.”
He meant by "Never check" not to stop the gun by trying to measure the lead before pulling the trigger.

Robert Churchill “Look at the bird. Ignore the gun.”

I do hope it works for anyone with dominance issues. I also hope to hear how it is working after a 4-6 week trial.


Phil is reviewing the article from 2007 to see if some revisions/clarifications need to be made.
 

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The idea that FNF's "Pull. Eyes on the target. Stay on the target, move and shoot. No peeking at the barrel to any degree." is a new revelation is just silly.

Rolla Heikes “Concentrate your mind on the bird, and do not allow anything else to attract your attention.”

Frederick Oliver Robinson, Earl de Grey, after 1909 the Second Marquess of Ripon (1852-1923) “Never check.”
He meant by "Never check" not to stop the gun by trying to measure the lead before pulling the trigger.

Robert Churchill “Look at the bird. Ignore the gun.”

I do hope it works for anyone with dominance issues. I also hope to hear how it is working after a 4-6 week trial.


Phil is reviewing the article from 2007 to see if some revisions/clarifications need to be made.
It's new to me, particularly the practice thereof - the subconscious part. I did pick up "Instinctive Shooting".
 

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I’m not an expert on this subject but here’s my opinion. If just focusing on the target cures your problem then you probably never had a cross dominance issue. You had a bad shooting technique issue. To think that some of the top shooters that do shoot 1 eyes don’t know to focus on the target is pretty silly to me.
 

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I’m not an expert on this subject but here’s my opinion. If just focusing on the target cures your problem then you probably never had a cross dominance issue. You had a bad shooting technique issue. To think that some of the top shooters that do shoot 1 eyes don’t know to focus on the target is pretty silly to me.
I’m thinking that this was my problem. I was holding a high gun and soft focusing in distance. I tried to have a barrel/bird connection and slowly move onto bird. I think I was looking at barrel frequently without realizing it. After shooting terribly for 1&1/2 years just holding gun lower (out of line of sight) and hard focusing on bird right out of house things have improved dramatically.
 

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I’m not an expert on this subject but here’s my opinion. If just focusing on the target cures your problem then you probably never had a cross dominance issue. You had a bad shooting technique issue. To think that some of the top shooters that do shoot 1 eyes don’t know to focus on the target is pretty silly to me.
I had a guy watch me the other day and told my I was behind on an angled target and behind and low on another. Smoked the next target in both cases. I believe what I was doing was sneaking a peak of my gun and loosing the target. The correction is to go with it (subconsciously): shoot-it-now, as in to stop looking for my gun to cross the target - trust my ability and smack it! This was a correction in my case. I'm not saying anything about top shooters.
 

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Joe, are you holding on the house and has your gun speed to the target increased ? By increase, I’m talking about breaking the target much closer to the house. Larry, has indicated he’s holding lower now.
 

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Joe, are you holding on the house and has your gun speed to the target increased ? By increase, I’m talking about breaking the target much closer to the house. Larry, has indicated he’s holding lower now.
No, I hold about flat unless I'm shooting wobble. Then I'm right on the top of the house. When I did it right - subconsciously, I believe I am breaking them closer to the house, and smoking them too.
 
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