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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I shot with a fellow this past Sunday at the trap range and he was shooting a Ljutic monogun. We were both shooting Gun Clubs and he noticed that I was hanging onto my empties so he offered that I could have his empties that were on the ground. Before he made the offer I had noticed they were quite dirty with black soot on the outside of the hull. They looked like my reloads do after quite a few firings yet he claimed they were factory new prior to each round we shot.

I've tried to come up with why his would look so dirty compared to mine looking, well, like they had only been fired once? Could it be that his chamber is fairly loose? While his gun appeared to be older and well used it also looked like he took care of his things so I assumed he cleaned the chamber and barrel regularly. It was kind of perplexing. Now I wish I would have taken him up on his offer so I could post a pic of what I'm describing.
 

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I noticed it in my Ljutic when I was forced to buy shells, and bought Gun Clubs, when my son wanted to do a third Jackpot shoot one day. I was hesitant about shooting steel bases in it, but that part was fine. My guess would be gas coming back and going around the hull which had already shrunk back, due to the overbore (.740). This is similar to sooty pistol cases with lighter loads. IIRC,the plastic used in Gun Clubs is different than for STS and Nitro (perhaps Scott could verify this if he sees this post); I don't have this problem with STS, Nitro, or AA hulls, factory or reloads.
 

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If you are talking about the outside of the hull, it could be that his chamber is more "loose" as you suggested, and allowing gases back between the hull exterior and the chamber walls.
 
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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
If you are talking about the outside of the hull, it could be that his chamber is more "loose" as you suggested, and allowing gases back between the hull exterior and the chamber walls.
Yeah, it was the outside of the hull. My guess is that somehow the gases were sneaking between the plastic hull and the chamber. Didn’t seem to affect the performance at all as he was smashing them pretty well.
 

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I recently acquired a Ljutic monogun, which btw I LOVE, and I think it does have a somewhat larger chamber. I recently loaded some shells using a different hull than I usually do and had some trouble loading them in a Browning Citori. It turns out I had to move the taper die down a little bit on my MEC 9000. In the Citori I had to push the shells into the chamber. With the Ljutic, they just dropped right in. I think the notion that the dirt on the outside of the hulls is due to a larger chamber is very credible. I usually shoot reloads but I will try to remember to dig out a box of factory Gun Clubs and try them next time I am out and see what results I get.

Even if the hulls come out a little dirty it's not going to trouble me in the least. That gun is a target crushing beast and a little soot on the hulls is a small price to pay for the way it performs.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
I recently acquired a Ljutic monogun, which btw I LOVE, and I think it does have a somewhat larger chamber. I recently loaded some shells using a different hull than I usually do and had some trouble loading them in a Browning Citori. It turns out I had to move the taper die down a little bit on my MEC 9000. In the Citori I had to push the shells into the chamber. With the Ljutic, they just dropped right in. I think the notion that the dirt on the outside of the hulls is due to a larger chamber is very credible. I usually shoot reloads but I will try to remember to dig out a box of factory Gun Clubs and try them next time I am out and see what results I get.

Even if the hulls come out a little dirty it's not going to trouble me in the least. That gun is a target crushing beast and a little soot on the hulls is a small price to pay for the way it performs.
I agree with you. The man shooting his Monogun with me was a great shot and was really smacking the clays. He doesn't reload so if I were him I wouldn't care one bit either. As an aside, I found it nice that he didn't look down on me for saving my empties for reloading. It seems odd to me that some people look at us reloaders like were peasants of sorts. I could buy factory ammo and only shoot that but I really enjoy the reloading process and I find it adds a great bit of satisfaction to a perfect round of trap, all with loads I made. I get the same joy catching a fish with a fly I tied.
 

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I could buy factory ammo and only shoot that but I really enjoy the reloading process and I find it adds a great bit of satisfaction to a perfect round of trap, all with loads I made. I get the same joy catching a fish with a fly I tied.
Or dropping all my deer with handloads. Done all those things. The satisfaction felt is something some non-reloaders may not understand.
 

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Don't let the dirt bother you. If they are once-fired, they are once fired. You could probably wipe if off with a cloth that had some sort of solvent on it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Don't let the dirt bother you. If they are once-fired, they are once fired. You could probably wipe if off with a cloth that had some sort of solvent on it.
Yeah, I gladly accepted them and will wipe them off with a used dryer sheet. I sometimes do that anyway to help prevent static on the hulls. Gotta love our dry Idaho air, lol.
 

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It has to be a slightly bigger chamber, wouldn’t take much unless the shells he had were somehow smaller diameter out towards the end
 

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Ljutics come from the factory with an .812 chamber. I was talking to Mike @ Ljutic again today and asked him about what was being said in this thread. He said it is not uncommon to see guns come back to the factory that have had the chamber opened up so they can shoot cheap ammo, usually it that cheap Winchester stuff. He said that there are a couple of barrel guys that will do it but most are done under a shade tree with a brake hone.
 

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One more vote for an oversize chamber, but from the opposite perspective.

My mono gun has had some work on the bore and choke by Tom Wilkinson. However, the chamber is as supplied by Ljutic. New Gun Clubs (and other steel based shells) will chamber but will not eject on a regular basis. They hang up in the chamber and must be forced out with a wad knocker or a dowel push rod. The outer surfaces of the hulls are free of powder burns. The hangups and the clean exterior surfaces combined seem to be consistent with the suggestions of chamber size being the source of the powder soot.

(Solution to the ejection issue in my case is to use brass-based shells and reloads.)

Cheers,
Pat
 

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(Solution to the ejection issue in my case is to use brass-based shells and reloads.)
Fortunately my Monogun doesn't seem to be too picky about the shell base material. Once in a while a steel base will stick but not very often. Unfortunately this solution shows signs of going the way of the dodo bird - we are now down to only 2 types of shells with real brass bases and with the financial troubles Remington is having who knows how long the STS and Nitr0 cases will continue to have brass bases. I hope it's a long time.
 

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I have had a lots of Ljutics over the years. Never had a problem with and shells other than Cheap Winchesters and some Rios I won at a shoot. I polish the chamber every now and then and that is all most all of them need.
 

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If you are talking about the outside of the hull, it could be that his chamber is more "loose" as you suggested, and allowing gases back between the hull exterior and the chamber walls.
Yes, that would be my take also. Over the years, I've noticed the difference in my own shotguns, and, depending on the chamber, there was a difference in how "dirty" the hulls were after shooting new shells.
 

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I have had a lots of Ljutics over the years. Never had a problem with and shells other than Cheap Winchesters and some Rios I won at a shoot. I polish the chamber every now and then and that is all most all of them need.
One more vote for an oversize chamber, but from the opposite perspective.

My mono gun has had some work on the bore and choke by Tom Wilkinson. However, the chamber is as supplied by Ljutic. New Gun Clubs (and other steel based shells) will chamber but will not eject on a regular basis. They hang up in the chamber and must be forced out with a wad knocker or a dowel push rod. The outer surfaces of the hulls are free of powder burns. The hangups and the clean exterior surfaces combined seem to be consistent with the suggestions of chamber size being the source of the powder soot.

(Solution to the ejection issue in my case is to use brass-based shells and reloads.)

Cheers,
Pat
Before acquiring my Monogun I always saw and heard that a lot of Ljutic's did not like steel based hulls. My 1971 Monogun handles all steel hulls just fine. While some Ljutic's may have problems not ALL of then do.
 
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