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CZ All American Trap Single for a Wheelchair Shooter

1723 Views 11 Replies 9 Participants Last post by  Boomstix
Hello All,
I am a new user to the forum but a long time lurker. I do not mean to open a can of worms here, but I am looking for relevant thoughts from people that might know more that I do. Back ground, I have a teenage wheelchair shooter that shoots for my team. Taken a lot of work to get where we are at. He finished his 10th grade season averaging 23-24 out of 25. He has done this with a Tristar setter 28" 12ga. It has lasted at least 2 full seasons with over 15k rounds put through it. It has given no trouble whatsoever. We break it down and clean internals and everything. We have put a limbsaver slip on over the gun, because he likes putting the gun on his collar bone for sighting purposes. I told him when he got to this point, we would upgrade him to a better fitting gun. He would be happy if I just bought 5 or 6 setters at wholesale and used them for parts to keep his in top order. I would rather find a gun that can be made to fit him and not him to the gun. I have even thought of buying them and buying the graco adjustable butplate and comb hardware and doing a custom job on his setter. I would rather buy one already set up.
I understand that there are some people that are going to trash the Turkish made guns for a variety of reasons. Some of them are justified, some are probably not. I will quantify my statements as following. Yes, the B guns are the best. I own several of them in rifles and handguns and do not doubt their quality or longevity. This is not my care or focus for this question.
We have had a youth 20ga tristar viper, a 12 ga 11-87, and now the setter. He outgrew the viper. Never had issues with it, that I couldn't fix for him.
Wheel chair shooters face an increased issue of balance that we as uprights can never fully grasp. Each chair shooter has certain limitations based on their reason for being in the chair. I would love to buy him a bt-99 but due to balance issues 30" barrel is the max length. That rules out the new bt-99. He has an average if not above average length of pull, so the micro bt-99 are out. In all fairness that rules out the majority of new trap guns including the tt15. The CZ all american fits the bill on features, price, and length. He prefers a gun that weighs no more that 7.5 lbs, again due to balance issues.
In my experience, felt recoil can be almost eliminated, may not be pretty but can be done. So my questions are this.
1.) Does anyone else have experience with wheelchair bound shooters?
2.) If you do, what guns did they have real success with.... I dont mean enjoy shooting, I mean clay dusting. He enjoys shooting/hunting already, has already killed 10pt and 12 pt bucks, but he likes winning. He wants to win, so I am trying to give him the tools i can.
3.) $1500 max price. Only interested in new. You never know how well the used was treated. Not looking to buy someone else's headaches.
4.) 30" max barrel length, prefer a break action as keeps the over all length down, if you go to semi , he has to get shorter barrel. Pumps are out of question for his safety do to balance issues.
5.) Prefer under 7.5 lbs
6.) can be a single or double
7.) Does anyone have any real experience with the CZ All American Trap single( what round counts are you at...how long you owned it?
8.) Any other ideas on other guns that fit that criteria?

Sorry if thats long winded or snide, I just didn't want alot of replies about the awesomeness of guns that wont fit him or that are out of price range.

Thank you for reading.
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Hello All,
I am a new user to the forum but a long time lurker. I do not mean to open a can of worms here, but I am looking for relevant thoughts from people that might know more that I do. Back ground, I have a teenage wheelchair shooter that shoots for my team. Taken a lot of work to get where we are at. He finished his 10th grade season averaging 23-24 out of 25. He has done this with a Tristar setter 28" 12ga. It has lasted at least 2 full seasons with over 15k rounds put through it. It has given no trouble whatsoever. We break it down and clean internals and everything. We have put a limbsaver slip on over the gun, because he likes putting the gun on his collar bone for sighting purposes. I told him when he got to this point, we would upgrade him to a better fitting gun. He would be happy if I just bought 5 or 6 setters at wholesale and used them for parts to keep his in top order. I would rather find a gun that can be made to fit him and not him to the gun. I have even thought of buying them and buying the graco adjustable butplate and comb hardware and doing a custom job on his setter. I would rather buy one already set up.
I understand that there are some people that are going to trash the Turkish made guns for a variety of reasons. Some of them are justified, some are probably not. I will quantify my statements as following. Yes, the B guns are the best. I own several of them in rifles and handguns and do not doubt their quality or longevity. This is not my care or focus for this question.
We have had a youth 20ga tristar viper, a 12 ga 11-87, and now the setter. He outgrew the viper. Never had issues with it, that I couldn't fix for him.
Wheel chair shooters face an increased issue of balance that we as uprights can never fully grasp. Each chair shooter has certain limitations based on their reason for being in the chair. I would love to buy him a bt-99 but due to balance issues 30" barrel is the max length. That rules out the new bt-99. He has an average if not above average length of pull, so the micro bt-99 are out. In all fairness that rules out the majority of new trap guns including the tt15. The CZ all american fits the bill on features, price, and length. He prefers a gun that weighs no more that 7.5 lbs, again due to balance issues.
In my experience, felt recoil can be almost eliminated, may not be pretty but can be done. So my questions are this.
1.) Does anyone else have experience with wheelchair bound shooters?
2.) If you do, what guns did they have real success with.... I dont mean enjoy shooting, I mean clay dusting. He enjoys shooting/hunting already, has already killed 10pt and 12 pt bucks, but he likes winning. He wants to win, so I am trying to give him the tools i can.
3.) $1500 max price. Only interested in new. You never know how well the used was treated. Not looking to buy someone else's headaches.
4.) 30" max barrel length, prefer a break action as keeps the over all length down, if you go to semi , he has to get shorter barrel. Pumps are out of question for his safety do to balance issues.
5.) Prefer under 7.5 lbs
6.) can be a single or double
7.) Does anyone have any real experience with the CZ All American Trap single( what round counts are you at...how long you owned it?
8.) Any other ideas on other guns that fit that criteria?

Sorry if thats long winded or snide, I just didn't want alot of replies about the awesomeness of guns that wont fit him or that are out of price range.

Thank you for reading.
I have no experience with what it takes to shoot from a wheelchair.
However I did buy one of the CZ All American Trap guns this spring. Have over 2000 rds thru it so far this year, NO problems.
What I have noticed that it isn't easly opened,that will probably change with use.The action does not open as far as I would like,but I have not compaired it to other single bbl ,s. I do have the 30" bbl.Not sure of the weight,but it is heavy in the action and butt stock.
 

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I may open a bigger can of worms than you, but you may have some success with a Go Fund Me campaign to raise a few extra bucks to get a more expensive gun fitted with a Graco (or equivalent) and adjustable comb. I cannot imagine the needs of a wheelchair shooter but I expect the more fitting options the better.

Jim
 

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Couldn’t you have the barrel of a new BT cut down to 30”? I know folks who have older 34s that were cut down to 32s and threaded for chokes.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
I have no experience with what it takes to shoot from a wheelchair.
However I did buy one of the CZ All American Trap guns this spring. Have over 2000 rds thru it so far this year, NO problems.
What I have noticed that it isn't easly opened,that will probably change with use.The action does not open as far as I would like,but I have not compaired it to other single bbl ,s. I do have the 30" bbl.Not sure of the weight,but it is heavy in the action and butt
I have no experience with what it takes to shoot from a wheelchair.
However I did buy one of the CZ All American Trap guns this spring. Have over 2000 rds thru it so far this year, NO problems.
What I have noticed that it isn't easly opened,that will probably change with use.The action does not open as far as I would like,but I have not compaired it to other single bbl ,s. I do have the 30" bbl.Not sure of the weight,but it is heavy in the action and butt stock.
Thank you for sharing your experience. I bet it does loosen up.
 

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I shoot sitting on a Rollator walker. Not the same as a wheelchair as I still can sit leaning forward when I shoot. I tried an over/under and it was difficult to open in a sitting position and ejecting empties without hitting myself was challenging. My experience with Turkish guns is they tend to be difficult to open. So, I shoot my old Remington 870 that I have been shooting for 40+ years at Clays and live birds long before my injury weakened my leg.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Hello All,
Thought I would give an update on the CZ and its use. They did purchase the CZ, It is a beautiful gun with excellent fit and finish. It is heavy from the action back, but that is awesome for his balance purposes. He has really never used the foregrips to hold his gun anyway. He has actually always used the receiver right in front of the trigger as his hold spot, lets him keep all the weight in close and rotate easier. May not seem like a big deal, but after at least 250 to 300 rds per practice, it helps not be as tired.
After a few fine tunings(Comb height and lop), he says the gun points itself now, he just has to stay out of its way. Last tournament he was 4th highest shot out of 125ish high school shooters. With this gun he is now hitting more 24 and 25 than not. 48 and 49 really annoy him now more than ever. So I think this is success.
It was really stiff to begin with, but is now less stiff and works well. Round count is only about 2500-3000 so far, but is functioning flawlessly. The only complaint he has had, is that he wishes he had gotten the set with the extra over/under barrels included....but he doesnt shoot doubles....yet
I have also noticed is it about 90/10 on pattern.
 
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