To CP- You use the same amount of Clays as ClayDot to get the same results. They are both fast burning powders. Beyond the 23 yd line most shooters use a slower burning powder such as Greedot or Titegroup. Claydot is at least 10-15 dollars cheaper than Clays & its made in America.
Guys, I typically use 17.8-18.3 grains of Clays for my 1175-1200 fps 1 1/8th oz loads, using Rem hulls, fig 8 wads and either WW or Rem 209 primers. The Alliant web site only recommends a 17.5 grain load (1145 fps), whereas the Hodgdon web site recommends both a 18.5 and 19.2 grain load...I was concerned that Alliant does not recommend a slightly hotter load.
The two powders are not the same, but are similar. I'd stick with the recommendations on the Alliant site for Clay Dot. I personally think that Clays is not well suited for 1200 fps loads with 1 1/8 oz of shot in the Remington or Winchester hulls. There is a reason why many shooters use powders such as Green Dot for the 1200 fps loads. Clays puts the pressures up over what some would consider reasonable. I try to stay well under 10,000 PSI and don't rely as much on the older LUPs measurements. If they develop fairly high pressures at whatever moderate room temperature they were tested at, what do you think they would develop in the heat of summer in a hot barrel? Leave a box in the hot car and they could easily reach 120 degrees or higher. I like a little more wiggle room than what Clays allows for the heavier loads.
from what- Quack Shot stated ,then Red Dot with Federal primer and wad & hull at 1200 fps , 10,000 psi , would be almost too much ? , this is the load im considering ., Clay Dot under the same setup comes in at 8750 psi... im kinda new to all the recipe's , I havent reloaded in 25 years , and just got my next Mec , does this mean Clay Dot is slower burning then Red Dot in this situation ?
In my machine, Clay Dot drops about 1/2 grain more weight/volume as Clays. I ignored the difference and used the same bushing, since both were within recommended pressure allowance. I believe, with hotter loads ~10,000 PSI, both powders were scorching/melting the wads and the inside of the hulls, thus reducing hull life, and coating my barrel with melted plastic. I've since changed to Green Dot and like the results, meaning the inside of the hull now has that gray, dusty look, like the once fired STS hulls, and the black scorched look is gone, along with the shreds of melted plastic from the barrel. I agree with our friends that Clays/Clay Dot is a good choice for less than handicap loads, year round. Regards ....mike
I recently contacted Hodgdon relative to the maximum charge that I should use for Clays with my components listed...They recommended that 18.2 grains should be the max, after that, move to a slower powder...this is about 1160-1175 fps according to the Hodgdon Reloading Center charts for 1 1/8th oz. loads. Still, is Clay Dot also a recommended powder for this charge or should I take their word and not exceed 17.5 grains...probably worth a call to Alliant to see what they say.
Again, volume/volume, I've found Clay Dot to be slightly more dense than Clays; however, when Alliant first took it to market, they were saying use the same loading tables as for Clays, and for my money that still holds. There was a law suit about trademark infringement, which Hodgen lost; but that may be the impetus for Alliant publishing slightly different data. In any case, your load of 17.5 grains is well within what is considered maximum with either powder. They publish the data on line Y'know.
mac, you really need to travel farther afield. Come to the Keystone Open or the PA State shoot this year. It cannot be any more than a 5 hour drive. You'll participate in a much larger shoot than the one's you do now, and you'll go home with a years worth of reloading supplies at bargain prices.
CAC usually has a trailer at the Keystone Open, and always for the State Shoot (and sometimes for the Westy Hogans). At those shoots, they sell everything at case prices. So if you want to experiment with two new wads, just buy 500 or 1000 each and pay the same price per bag as you would for a case of 5000. West Coast shot is always sold for $4 to $12 less per bag than anywhere else. Promo is usually $78/8lb. It was on sale for $65 at the Keystone and $68 at the State Shoot. Regular prices for the normal Alliant powders is $85/8lb. Clay Dot is $82 and e3 is $92. Something is always on sale. Hodgdon prices are reasonable. If they run out of something, they replenish it overnight. Since you have such a hard time finding supplies, this would be an oprtunity to get everything you ever wanted to try, load up for the year, and have a ball shooting.