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Discussion Starter #1
Since the Federal 12C1 wads are discontinued, hard to find, and prohibitively priced; is there a decent substitute wad for loading 1-1/8 ounce shot into a Fed. paper hull with about 22-23 grains of Green Dot? I'm hoping to end up with a load around 1225-1250 fps that patterns nice and dense for handicap. I've got some Downrange Versalites and DRF3's (12S3 clones) available to try, but would appreciate your experience and expertise on this. Thanks in advance for the help. ....Rick
 

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Cut open a new Fed Paper an see wht is in it and judge for yourself the best wad. But I think you'd be quite happy with the 12S3
 

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The CB3118-12AR, or Red 8 is a great wad that should replace the 12C1.

It gives great loads in the Top Gun hull with a bulky powder.
 

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The Fed 12S-4 is a 1¼ oz wad, but works great for 1-1/8 load in a paper hull if you're loading a big charge of a bulky powder. 23 gr of GreenDot is a big charge. I don't think you could crimp that load over a 12S-3 wad or a clone of it.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
RickN, thank you for that very helpful picture! I can see at a glance that the 12S3 wad is probably going to be too tall for the 1-1/8 Green Dot load unless it would really compress down, and I'm a little leery doing that. I'm thinking maybe the 12S4 is the ticket, as the CB3118-12AR looks to be pretty long as well unless I go to a much denser powder than Green Dot. ...Rick
 

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When one is comparing wad heights, one should set each wad on a pillar, such as a spent primer, of equal height. Wads vary in distance from the cup lip to the base. Because it is the height of the wad from its base to its top that we actually want to measure, this allows one to see that, as well as how deep the cup section of each wad is. I was reminded of this recently by fellow pot shooter Big Rod.
 

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The Versalites from downrange work perfectly. We have loaded several cases of them in the papers and shoot nothing else from the 27 yard line with no problems. The cb 3118's work as do the 12s3 but crimp is not nearly as uniform as with versalite.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Wireguy, you brought up a good point. I had forgotten that wads can really vary by bottom powder-cup depth, and I had heard that the Versalites have a very deep powder cup in the base. I'm to hear back from Alliant for a correction on some data that must be misprinted in their guide. If you go online onto their guide and select Federal paper hulls with 1-1/8 oz loads, Green Dot for the powder and Versalite for the wad you can see what I mean:

Shotshell
12 Gauge
2 3/4-in. Federal Paper Target Shells
1 1/8 shot wt.

Dram Equiv. Shot Wt.
(ounces) Velocity
(fps) Primer Powder Wad Grains psi
--- 1 1/8 1,145 Fed 209A Green Dot Versalite 19.5 6,900
--- 1 1/8 1,200 Fed 209A Green Dot Versalite 21 8,300
--- 1 1/8 1,250 Fed 209A Green Dot Versalite 22.5 8,500
--- 1 1/8 1,200 Fed 209A Green Dot Versalite 19.5 9,000

You would think that the last entry would be 1300 fps with maybe 24.0 grains of Green Dot, but I want to confirm this with Alliant first. ....Rick
 

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Why not use the real thing? I know where 10 cases are sitting. They can be had for $118.80 plus tax and shipping. I've tried several wads in papers but nothing works as well as the 12C1. The next best would be the windjammer. E-mail me if you are interested.
Dave Vice.
 
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