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Discussion Starter #1
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Under clear blue skies and no wind from the 27 yard line...

Two of our regular Handicap shooters who both routinely break 21 - 23 from the 27 yard line tried something a little different today.

They tried Remington factory loads of 1-1/8 ounce of #9 shot at 1145 fps.

With the #9 shot, combined they broke 28 clay targets out of fifty instead of their usual 42 - 46 out of fifty.

Not a big sample, but interesting none the less.

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It would be more interesting if the shooters didn't know the shot size until AFTER they finished shooting. Its called a 'double blind test' and works like this... Someone hands the shooter a shell. The shooter doesn't know if the shell has 7 1/2's or 9's in it. The person handing the shell to the shooter also doesn't know if it contains 7 1/2's or 9's.

Double blind test are standard experimental procedure because test results are frequently biased by test subjects' expectations. In this case a double blind test would ensure that any difference in results was the result of shot size NOT shooter expectations.

sissy
 

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Discussion Starter #5
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Agree that double-blind would have been better.

In this particular case, both shooters wanted to see what I was giving them to put into their Krieghoffs.

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So if a 27 yard shooter shoots 9 shot at a registered shoot and tries his best to break them all, would he be a sandbagger?
 

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You said: "They tried Remington factory loads of 1-1/8 ounce of #9 shot at 1145 fps." I personally find Gun Clubs are adequate for Singles but the lead shot is not hard enough for Handicap. STS is a better shell. I would not try #9 shot for Handicap.
 

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It would be unwise to classify my shooting with the people mentioned in this thread. However, I have a similar experience to relate. When I've shot skeet I use an ounce of #9. By mistake, I pulled one of those boxes when I shot a 21 yard round. My score wasn't great, but more distressing was the the hits were so bland - a few chips here and there. They were still breaks.

I realized the mistake shortly before the end of the round and was relieved that I hadn't slipped "that much". Just for grins, then, I used some 1 1/8 # 7 1/2s for a round of skeet. HOLY SMOKE - and I mean SMOKE. I'm just a hack shooter and I thoroughly enjoyed the oooohs and ahhhs when both hi and low were just ink spots (especially on station 8).

I am fully aware that the intention of clay sports is to break the maximum number of clays - and that "25 chipped is better that 24 smoked and one miss". Still, the smoke part of a hit is rewarding for me.

Larry
 

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I shot from the 25yd. this weekend. Shot the same score, that wasn't very good, but it was the same score with 1 1/8 oz., 1200 fps., 7 1/2's, as the 1 oz., 1235 fps., 8 1/2's. Breaks where the same when I hit them. I don't shoot much handicap.
 

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OK I understand the double blind test theory. But in this example how would you know the outcome of the test if neither the shell tender or the shooter knew which was which.

Obviously, someone has to know or the results could never be verified.

Maybe you could blindfold the shooter so he wouldn't know...oh nevermind, that won't work either.
 

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Hall of Fame trap shooter Dick Bennitt from Wisconsin already did the double blind test with #8's vs #7 1/2's. He and another 27 yarder of equal average randomly shot I believe a flat of each. The boxes were labeled so only the score keeper would know

The 7 1/2's won by a noticeable margin from the 27.
 

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Guys, pay close attention to how the current and future targets break, regardless of legal size shot used. An all pitch target of yesteryear is a far different animal than what your going to be shooting here shortly, or possibly now? Be observant boys!

Hap
 

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In 2003 I was shooting in a handicap squad at Vandalia during prelim week and Joe Ljutic was the #4 shooter. He was down 1 target in 75 and when we got to the 4th field he sort of turned pale when he pulled out his last box of AA shells. Instead of Super Handicaps he had a box of 1 1/8oz 2 3/4dr. #9's.(He used them for the first shot of doubles...) He asked each of us if we had an extra box and no one did. He shrugged his shoulders and said "I guess I'll shoot these!"

He missed the first target out...and ran the last 24! Granted there were not any smoke balls ... but they broke! His 98 was good for a sizable chunk of money and later on I asked him if he was switching to 9 shot for 'caps. His answer is not printable here.

Point being, if you put enough shot on the target even 9's will break them! However, I do recommend 7 1/2's,

Bob
 

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A friend of mine once shot a practice round from 27 yds with reloaded 1 1/8 ounce of 9's. He got them all. But when asked if he would switch to 9's for handicap 27 yds, the answer was no.
 
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