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Shot CAM...is it worth it?

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deadinthedecoys

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Discussion starter · #1 ·
One of local shooters is pulling his hair out trying to figure out why his scores do not improve with practice. He is in the process of purchasing a shot cam...at a cost that is not trivial. My question is "What use have they been to those of you that have used them?"

I can see the shot almost always when watching a shooter from behind (within about 20 degrees left or right) and am perhaps spoiled by having a very good idea of why he missed or did not miss a particular target. He seems convinced that is the next thing needed to improve his shooting. What is your experience/opinion on shot cams...
 
#2 ·
Its just a tool. Your buddy will be able to see where he missed targets. Of course the shot-cam will not tell him why he missed the target!!! I say, rent a shot-cam for a week. Then return the unit. Now you can see the results of each broken and each missed target. Most misses, the shooter is shooting behind the target. However, a few misses are from shooting over the target. If you record your buddy while he is shooting. You can film him, if he is lifting his head? Or perhaps bead checking while he is shooting. I expect these are the two biggest reasons we miss targets. Of course you also have the dreaded I hope I don't miss the next target syndrome!!! As soon as you start to "Think". You start to "Stink"!!! LOL. Good Luck to ya both. break em all Jeff
 
#3 ·
For me it helps to identify gun movement before the target clears the barrel. Also shows how well I am tracking the target and where I was pointing when the trigger is actuated. You can also identify if you have consistent timing from mount to target call. Along with our Garmin, I would say it is a helpful tool and I do not regret the purchase.
 
#4 ·
The amazing thing is that I can see both post 2 and post 3 being correct. Again, you look at the shot cam and say " I shot high and behind that target." But what really matters is WHY! If you can translate what you see on the shot cam to why you did it, it will help you. I watched a lot of shot cam video, and that is the same thing I got out of the videos. Namely, if you see this, you did that. It was not the videos that was helpful, but the explanation of what you did to make the video look the way it did. I really loved watching an expert doubles shooter with the shot cam. If you can translate what the magic dot did to what the shooter did, you will learn something.

I think it would be fantastic to see a synchronized side by side video of the shot cam view and the shooters movements. The shooter did this, the dot did that kind of comparison. Other wise it comes down to an agreed upon explanation of when the dot moves like that, you must have done this.

Go look at all those shot cam videos on the internet, then decide if it will help you.
 
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#5 ·
deadinthedecoys said:
One of local shooters is pulling his hair out trying to figure out why his scores do not improve with practice. He is in the process of purchasing a shot cam...at a cost that is not trivial. My question is "What use have they been to those of you that have used them?"

I can see the shot almost always when watching a shooter from behind (within about 20 degrees left or right) and am perhaps spoiled by having a very good idea of why he missed or did not miss a particular target. He seems convinced that is the next thing needed to improve his shooting. What is your experience/opinion on shot cams...
Click to expand...
It's not going to show if your head is on the stock. If a person can afford it, it would be fun.
 
#6 ·
N Bare said:
It's not going to show if your head is on the stock. If a person can afford it, it would be fun.
Click to expand...
Actually, it does. When the target goes out of frame on the bottom, it's telling you, you lifted your head.

When properly set up and zero on a barrel, it shows you where you are pointing the gun, on any given target.

The best scenario is if a shooter can use both the camera and a Garmin, not at the same time, but in conjunction with one another.
 
#7 ·
Pull & Mark said:
Your buddy will be able to see where he missed targets.
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I have one and it definitely does not resolve the shot cloud at clay hitting distance. You can sometimes see a frame that captures the shot when it is near the muzzle IF you have the right background. Blue sky seems to show shot the best.

It is good for seeing gun motion issues. Mine really helped me see that my angles were all wrong. It also showed me my canting problems. I did work out a way to make sure the camera was truly level to the gun. I put an 8 foot level on my fence and put the gun 30 feet away on a table also set to level with a bubble level. Then I made sure the cam was mounted so the horizontal reticle line was parallel to the level on the fence.

If you want to see where you actually missed, get a Garmin Xero S1.

I like to say this: Garmin shows you where you missed while Shotcam and show you some of the reasons why you missed.
 
#9 ·
Rhodesengr said:
I have one and it definitely does not resolve the shot cloud at clay hitting distance.
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It is my understanding, that you can set a red dot on the shot cam, to match the center of your pattern. So if you do this. You can see where the gun has shot for each target. Without seeing your shot-stream!!! I do not have a shot-cam. I also do not know which version of shot-cam you have. You can buy the up-dates if your shot-cam does not have this feature??? So my point is, you don't have to see the shot cloud to see where your shot went!!! At least, this is what I have been told. I have shot with the whole crew that works for "Shot-Cam" They are a Florida based company. They have a good product, and product support to match.

One of my shooting buddies, bought the first edition shot-cam "real cheap". He talked to one of shot-tech's over the phone and spent the money for the total updated software package. I am still waiting for him to set it up and use his shot-cam. I expect he will never get the shot-cam working at this point. He bought the up-dated soft-ware about 2 years ago, and has still not used it!!! sigh.

I have not seen, or used the Garman cameral system. I suspect it too, is just a tool. If your say the Garman system is better?, I would take your word for it. Nothing beats working with a shooting coach IMO. No way, will you ever be able to see a side by side view of both products in Sync with each other!!! Two separate companies!!!
Nora Ross uses a camera as a "Aid" for her shooting clinic's. Not sure which brand though. But she just uses the camera, mostly to get you to see what she is telling you your issues are. Most shooters will not believe something. Unless they see it on a camera!!! So we are back to camera's are just a tool. break em all Jeff
 
#10 ·
IF you take your laptop out there and check it right after a miss then it can tell you if your lead is correct. I recorded my entire session of skeet or sporting clays and could tell where most of my misses were but could not recall what the lead looked like at the time. It would be great to take it to a sporting clays course along with a laptop and shoot a stage that you’re having trouble with but your shooting partners aren’t going to want to stop and analyze your every shot AND I can tell you that your friends that are trying to tell you which way you’re missing a target are usually full of..it. Experience and practice.
 
#11 · (Edited)
Pull & Mark said:
It is my understanding, that you can set a red dot on the shot cam, to match the center of your pattern. So if you do this. You can see where the gun has shot for each target.
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Yes but it doesn't work the way you think. You can choose a number of reticle shapes. Red dot is one. I like to use the cross because you can set the horizontal line to true level as I mentioned. The app allows you to move the reticle around in the field of view after you have the gun mounted. The instructions suggest that you set the reticle to your POA (not the POI). So it is sort of a two person job. The shooter holds the gun and rifle-aims it at a distant point. Any point out about 30 or 40 yards will do. Person 2 then uses the phone app to move the reticle to align with the point you are aiming at. Some people try to adjust the reticle to the POI but that is harder to do and can change with distance.

So if the cam is carefully set to the POA, that's the first issue with using the reticle to infer your shot location. The other issue is that the gun jumps as soon as you fire so when the shot hits (or misses) the clay, the dot is nowhere near where it was when you fired. But like I said, it did help me see that my lead angles were way off and other gun motion issues. You have to use one to really understand what it does and doesn't do.

Pull & Mark said:
If your say the Garman system is better?, I would take your word for it.
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Not better, just different. They are both useful but in different ways. If you believe the data, only the Garmin actually shows the relationship between the shot cloud and the target. I say "if" because sometimes I wonder. I've had shots that say I am off by 5 inches with no break. I find that hard to believe. Based on my actual test patterns analyzed with Shotgun Insight, the hit probability within a 10 inch circle is close to 100%.

To each their own but I've tried coaching and clinics. I have also bought a number of the leading DVDs. They all tend to profess their particular method. Some profess high hold. Some profess low hold. Some profess looking aligned with the barrel and some profess looking at the center of the house. Some claim they can see where you shot and I don't believe that. Look, I'll never be a great trap shooter. I do it for fun and as a hobby. I think coaching is great to get the basics and learn the range of what very successful shooters do. I've seen enough to know that there is no one correct method. I like to muddle along and use the gizmos to see what I'm actually doing. I recently pulled out my Garmin after not using it for a year. It said most of my shots were low-ish. So I clicked my rib down until most of my shots were level with the clay. I think my shooting delay had gone down so the targets were rising more after bang than they were a year ago.
 
#14 ·
Shot cams, Garmins & their ilk can be helpful. It just too bad you can’t lease them for a couple of weeks & return them. Think of all the shelf space one could save.
 
#15 ·
The guys that want to use one should talk to the executives of their respective clubs and see if the club would buy a shotkam and charge a daily fee to use it and collect the data, I'm sure within no time they would recoup their cost and be making money on it IMHO
 
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#17 ·
My buddy has the newest one. You can watch the videos in like a minute after you shoot. He was having problems shooting a bird, so I grabbed his gun and shot it for him. It’s defiantly interesting watching your gun movements
 
#20 ·
jigs1920 said:
My buddy has the newest one. You can watch the videos in like a minute after you shoot. He was having problems shooting a bird, so I grabbed his gun and shot it for him. It’s defiantly interesting watching your gun movements
Click to expand...
I believe that was the most educational part of the shot cam exorcise, watching gun movement.
For me it was moving the gun around during my setup. I recall thinking what the heck am I doing with all that gun movement?
I stopped & that improved my scores.
 
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