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Remington 870 Express vs. Wingmaster

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Mr. D

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Discussion starter · #1 ·
I have been wanting to add a Remington 870 to my shotgun collection for some time now and was looking back during the COVID lockdown but things got too stupid and I put that on the back burner.

Today I was back out poking around the internet and came across a TS thread where a forum member stated that the old Remington 870 Express was not as smooth as a Wingmaster, but with some time and use, it could be smoothed out. What sets the Express and Wingmaster apart from a smoothness standpoint?

From Swanpy16 --> The Express is no Wingmaster and the Fieldmaster is no Express.

If what I'm seeing is correct the current 870 is only offered new in an Express or Fieldmaster and a Wingmaster would have to be used. I'm fine with new or used just trying to understand the difference outside of cosmetics.

Dennis
 
#4 ·
I have both Wingmasters and Express guns. The wingmaster is beautiful in terms or fit and finish. Actions are smooth as glass.

Express are very utilitarian. Matte finish that fits right in on a tactical gun. They do get the job done though. If you want to smooth out the action like a wingmaster. I just take out the bolt and put some super fine valve grinding compound in the frame rails. Reassemble and rack the gun 50-100 strokes. Enough to smooth out the high spots but not enough to wear it out. Disassemble wash out the action with WD40. Oil and reassemble. Should now feel like a Wingmaster when racking.
 
#5 · (Edited)
big kahuna said:
nitro27man will be along I'm sure and I would greatly value his opinion.
Click to expand...
NItroman was the gentleman who stated on another thread that the Rem. Express 870 was a well made shotgun for today. But, he made a comment that the Express was not as smooth as the old Wingmaster, but a good gun. I assumed by his statement that the smoothness would come as the gun was worn in? We all know what happens when one assumes!!! Anyway, That is what our OP brought up to discuss. Todays guns have zero hand fitting. Everything is CNC machined. A quick bluing that is not polished requires no polishing to save on labor. The old Wingmasters had better hand fitted (hand polished) parts, better wood, a better deeper polished bluing finish. They also had light contour barrels that are no longer being made. So to keep costs in line, the hand fitting and polishing had to go.

If you really want to add a 870 to your collection. I would wait for nice used 870 Wingmaster to come up for sale at a gun/pawn shop near you. Or from a local at one of your gun clubs. You will find very high prices on used Remington guns on the internet right now. So your best deals will be on something local. Good Luck to Ya. You want the chrome bolt, and fixed choked light contour barrel guns. break em all jeff
 
Discussion starter · #6 ·
Yes I agree used local would be ideal, sounds like the internal parts are machined the same so just trying to understand why one would be smoother than another. If buying used I would for sure go with a Wingmaster.
 
#7 ·
I would hold out for a nice wingmaster and there are plenty of the out there I have had both and I will say for certain that I would rather have a worn out wingmaster than any express ever made
and as will most old timers at the rate remington is going right now they won't be around too much longer
 
#9 ·
IMO Wingmasters are what the outcome of an Express could be provided additional time was spent finishing internal parts. Then you would have to find a better tree to cut down, something rather than a piss elm.

If you want a better 870 silver spoon is what you’re looking to acquire. These will however sell for more money than other Wingmasters because of this.
 
#10 ·
The Express was Remington's economy shotgun; the story be told, Remington's President at the time resisted making a economy (cheaper) shotgun and finally gave the green light to sales and marketing staff. The staff was right on cue, Remington made tons of money on the Express as rough as it was it sold well.

I've handled the new "RangeMaster" its no Express, the action is smooth, Illion polishing the action rods for what made the 870 famous. If you desire an older 870, the late 1960 and early 1970 chrome lifter models were hand fitted, they are slick. These can be identified by shiny chrome lifter shell lifter and serial #'s pre-fix beginning with "S" or "T".

Rem Arms slow out of the gate but handled 870's and 700's, flawless, the quality is there for all to enjoy. I understand Rem Arms future 700 barrels might be 5R rifling, all the 700 5R rifles I've shot all have been real good shooters, sub MOA.
 
#11 ·
eyosh said:
I just take out the bolt and put some super fine valve grinding compound in the frame rails. Reassemble and rack the gun 50-100 strokes. Enough to smooth out the high spots but not enough to wear it out. Disassemble wash out the action with WD40. Oil and reassemble. Should now feel like a Wingmaster when racking.
Click to expand...
An old time Skeet shooting Champion in NY State by the name of Harold Contant used to shoot the 870s until he began using the 1100s, and one day saw me with my 870. He did the same thing to my 870 as was mentioned by eyosh, and my gun became as smooth as silk. Harold owned a service station in Central Upstate NY, and knew a lot of tricks to improving things. Gone now, but memories of him shooting still live on.
 
#16 · (Edited)
Internals and externals on a Wingmaster we're just better finished... I had a 50s 16 gauge that shucked as smooth as a baby's butt... The wood was just OK for a plain barrel 28" , but then I didn't buy it for it's looks...
 
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#17 ·
pheasantmaster said:
IMO Wingmasters are what the outcome of an Express could be provided additional time was spent finishing internal parts. Then you would have to find a better tree to cut down, something rather than a piss elm.

If you want a better 870 silver spoon is what you’re looking to acquire. These will however sell for more money than other Wingmasters because of this.
Click to expand...
The early Express was exactly what is said here.

The early express, all the internal machining was done well but the outside the work stopped there.
Later it seems like there were shortcuts taken and feed reliability issues started showing up. But Wingmasters of that era were having the same feed reliability issues also.

I would see if I could take a test drive with a used 870.

Al
 
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#19 ·
I personally would not be interested in an Express unless it was an early version and I wanted to hunt waterfowl or turkey’s. Wingmasters are beautiful guns, period ! If you get as much out of looks as you do shooting (and many of us do) get a Wingmaster. I for one will find myself admiring a gun throughout a days use. I wouldn’t be doing that with an Express. Not taking away the quality but the visual pleasure just isn’t there for me. I love guns, I love handling guns, I love looking at guns. If you want a tool buy the Express. If you want quality in every aspect, buy the Wingmaster. I promise you this, you won’t be disappointed in a Wingmaster, but you may be with an Express. Spend the extra, get the extra. Remington at one time made spectacular guns, I have a mid 70’s 760 that’s is absolutely gorgeous and after a trigger job will almost put them in the same hole at 100 yards.
 
#20 ·
There are many other posts on other forums that wax lyrical about the differences in great detail, so it seems slightly redundant to type out a long winded dissertation on the subject here....again. To be brief:

Express: made to compete with the Mossberg 500. Very rough bead blast finish, plastic trigger group, and birch wood. Usually very rough chambers depending on which era Express you wind up with. Make sure it will cycle all loads you intend on shooting in it. Oh and it uses a garbage MIM extractor so you might consider replacing with a milled one.

Wingmaster: top tier version of the 870. high polish blue finish, metal trigger guard and walnut wood. Older models used milled extractors from the factory and chambers and all internals are polished to a lustrous, silky smooth finish. If you want a fancy target gun or a pretty gun to look at, get this one.

Fieldmaster: mid-range level 870. This is essentially a Wingmaster grade gun with a Express finish (supposedly upgraded). I have two and both of these came out of the box slicker than snail snot. The action bars are tumbled and polished like a Wingmaster and the chamber as well as the ENTIRE inside of the receiver are as smooth as silk. Mine have been 100% reliable. The biggest issue I had with mine is that they are still coming with MIM extractors. Oh well, I replaced both of mine with milled ones and am happy.
 
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Mr. D
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