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Differences between Winchester AA shells?

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Timmer92

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Discussion starter · #1 · (Edited)
Hi all,

Are there significant component differences within the line of Winchester AA series - Light, Lite, Heavy, and Super-Handicap shells? I assume the shot hardness is the same?

For the last few weeks I've been shooting Super-Handicap 1250's that I had lying around and boy does my Fabarm Axis RS12 like them. I've gotten a 24 three weeks in a row in my trap league. I've noticed 2 things. First, when I'm on target I'm turning them into smoke. My teammates have made several comments. Also, when I'm slightly off target I'm still breaking portions of the bird. I'm feeling invincible as there are times where I know I've screwed up but I'm still getting the bird. I'm shooting at 16 yards so the 1250's are a bit heavy by my estimate. I'm wondering if the 1200's would perform just as well?

Thanks,
Tim
 
#2 ·
#4 ·
Timmer92 said:
Are there significant component differences within the line of Winchester AA series - Light, Lite, Heavy, and Super-Handicap shells? I assume the shot hardness is the same?
Click to expand...
No significant component differences.

1250's work fine from 16 yards but its over kill.
1200's work fine from 16 yards but its over kill.

The majority of top 16 yard shooters are using 1&1/8th ounce of 8's @ 1145 FPS.
AA is a great shell choice.

Its All good
West
 
Discussion starter · #6 · (Edited)
timb99 said:
Generally, yes. But it varies from lot to lot, so it's not guaranteed.
Click to expand...
I'm a turkey hunter and have patterned countless shells between guns and chokes, both my own and in helping others. I am aware that various shells perform well or poorly in different gun configurations. I haven't put a ton of thought into shells being that different from lot to lot, I would assume there are differences but also some average level of consistency, but maybe I assume too much?

timb99 said:
Yes. In fact, for 16 yard, 1145 would perform just as well.
Click to expand...
I would think the same thing. However, I was using AA 1145's in both practice and leagues for 9 weeks and struggling. When I switched to the AA 1250's the difference was night and day. I'm 7 boxes in and by my standards I'm crushing it. Three 24's in leagues and 22-24 in practice.

This difference is largely the reason I started this post. I wanted to understand the differences and options. I have used AA 1200's in the past but the is the first time I've used 1145's. Also, it's a new gun as of mid-season last year so I haven't tried many different shells.
 
Discussion starter · #7 · (Edited)
senorric said:
Are they legal to shoot in a league? I was under the belief they had to be sub 1200/fps -----
Click to expand...
My club has a 1300fps maximum. If trap leagues have a limit below that I am unaware.

I have historically used 1200's and as noted in my original post just recently have used some 1250's I had lying around.
 
#8 ·
Timmer92 said:
My club has a 1300fps maximum. If trap leagues have a limit below that I am unaware.
Click to expand...
Even with a 1 oz. load, a 1300 fps shell has significant recoil and is totally unnecessary for 16 yard trap targets.

I wouldn't even consider shooting a 1 1/8 oz. shell at that speed.

To all you guys out there that want the most shot and speed you can get out of a load, be prepared for the consequences you may face in the future.

Remember, the effect that recoil has on the human body can be traumatic.

IMO, it's just not worth it.

Good Luck and Good Shooting!
 
#10 ·
2 things come to mind. Winchester is loading their premium Super Handicap to closer tolerances in terms of the amount of shot and the tolerance may be on the heavier side of 1 1/8 oz with no less than. Also with the higher velocity, on your near misses, the few pellets that hit the target are breaking the target .
The shells may be helping your mental part of the game. Seeing the smoked targets increases your confidence.

Jason
 
Discussion starter · #11 ·
Thanks storeman. I specifically asked about differences in shell components within the AA line. The crowd seems to agree that a 1250 shell is overkill and 1145's should suffice at 16 yards. Your data proves there is quite a bit of "foot pounds of recoil energy" for the 1250s. Perhaps I'm missing a further point being made by you as to whether that's good or bad or how it would affect performance?
 
Discussion starter · #12 ·
waverider said:
2 things come to mind. Winchester is loading their premium Super Handicap to closer tolerances in terms of the amount of shot and the tolerance may be on the heavier side of 1 1/8 oz with no less than. Also with the higher velocity, on your near misses, the few pellets that hit the target are breaking the target .
The shells may be helping your mental part of the game. Seeing the smoked targets increases your confidence.
Jason
Click to expand...
That's interesting. I wonder how many more pellets would be needed to make a significant functional difference.

And I hear you, there is definitely a mental component to the game and confidence does help. I would be open to the idea that some portion of it was mental but I grabbed them in passing in the first place with no expectations of better performance. As a matter of fact, if I had any thought a difference it would have been that they were too heavy and I could get sore, or worse yet flinch, and it would shake my confidence.
 
#13 ·
Timmer92 said:
I am aware that various shells perform well or poorly in different gun configurations.
Click to expand...
Actually, testing shows this to be "mostly" based on pellet hardness. I say mostly because there are other factors, such as the wad. But mostly hardness of the pellets. In general, certain barrels don't "like" one shell or another. If the internal dimensions are the same, the barrels will behave the same.
 
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#14 · (Edited)
waverider said:
Winchester is loading their premium Super Handicap to closer tolerances in terms of the amount of shot and the tolerance may be on the heavier side of 1 1/8 oz with no less than.
Click to expand...
That is generally true of all of their AA cartridge line. Remington does the same thing with STS and Nitro cartridges. AA's and STS will all have more shot than Universals or Gun Clubs.

Cut apart some AA's or some STS's and weigh the shot charge and they'll all be above advertised weight.

SAAMI allows 3% over published weight, and 5% below.

Premium cartridges are almost always 2% over weight or more.

Promo cartridges are almost always less.
 
#16 ·
Timmer92 said:
I would assume there are differences but also some average level of consistency, but maybe I assume too much?
Click to expand...
If you buy premium shells (AA's and STS is what are the top premium shells these days) you can count on the best components being used. The promotional shells (Gun Club, Universal, Super Target, so on) generally use softer shot, and won't pattern as well as the premium shells do.

To answer your question, yes, the shot hardness varies batch to batch, lot to lot, but "generally" if it says AA or STS on the box, it's going to be pretty good. Neil Winston has found that some AA's do indeed test out as "moderately hard" while other batches have tested out "very hard."

The only way to know is test, and most people don't do that.

But by and large, at 16 yards, most all of them work "good enough."

The real tale is told when you start shooting back at 25 yards or more. That is when the difference between premium shells and promo shells becomes more apparent.
 
#18 ·
I'd like to see their formula, for where they got the numbers, before I conclude anything.
 
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