The Hall of Fame is scheduled to be placed in storage until a new location is selected.

Once stored it might never again see the light of day.

Kenny Ray has retired. What next?

Should move to Cardinal center. More people to view it and more donations for the HOF.

Should move to World Shooting Complex, Sparta, Illinois. More people to view it and more donations for the HOF.

I think it should be moved to the dry heat in AZ. That's where a good portion of the former great shooters go to shoot in the winter time. Will give the snowbirds something else to do in the winter.

But I'll settle for the WSRC 8)

Of course King Leo is in California now, I think it should follow him around..

Ill one big NO. Its not OUR graound and who's to say it it will not be yanked out from under us.

I hope the C.C is bought and paid for. If so I say put it there. That way the building and HOF will always be there without the threat of being yanked out from under us.

Uhhh the Cardinal Center is privately owned just like the WSRC is. The ATA does not own a thing there. If Mr. Fishburn or his heirs decide to pull the plug, it could also be gone in a heartbeat. The ATA doesn't own the Cardinal Center or anything there in Ohio. Its all in Sparta now and tge Grand is here with a signed contract to at least 2025. With Ohio also not following the ATA's addition of categories and the constant talk of forming their own organization, why would the ATA want to even think about that move???

OHIO is gun friendly. Ill is not.

You are a moron and I am not.

Ohio showed how gun friendly it was when the ATA was forced to move.

Now Neal, I hope you realize(and you do know) that the forced move was a political business decision. The airport authority thought they could get more out of Emory Air freight than what the ATA was doing for them with the 2 shoots a year. You see how that worked out for them!!

Scott

It wasn't Ohio that kicked the ATA out of the state..it was the stupidity of the past EC's that caused the ATA to go begging.

The ATA's EC knew back in the late 80's that a move was to be in the future, but nothing was ever done until it became crunch time and then the buttheads went looking with virtually no wallet.

The ATA was very lucky that the state of IL (gun friendly or not) ponied up the millions to provide a world class site.

Curt

Didn't Mr. Fishburn offer a parcel of land to the ATA for it to own? It looks like the HoF may be history so why not Ohio where the land was free? Isn't that the reason the Grand ended up in IL, it was a no cost move?

Neal Crausbay, Ohio tried to keep the Grand in Ohio by offering other land. TX tried to get them, Las Vegas even tried. All gun friendly. The ATA stuck it to them selves by putting their heads up their back side think nothing is wrong. The writting was on the wall with the airport and they did nothing. 106 years and they couldn't buy enough land somewhere and keep this from happening. They only saw the present and not the future. Now we are nothing but homeless beggers. They the Board was determained to go to Ill at all cost. They went through their Delegate voting and the delegates DIDN'T vote the way the members wanted them to. The members wanted them to vote a big NO. They didn't and now we are in Ill. All BS.

So what's wrong with Illinois? Things seem to be just fine.

The move of the ATA and the site for the GAH is settled.

The Hall of Fame is a completely different matter. THOF is an independent organization that was a tenant in the ATA building in Vandalia. A new location seems to hinge on whether the collection should be displayed at Sparta, where there is the largest gathering of trapshooters or in another location where a year-round group of sportsmen and the general public would be able to enjoy it.

A St. Louis location, possibly promoted by Budweiser, has been suggested. This would be an hour's trip from Sparta so it would be an easy trip for shooters at the GAH. Locating it near a large population would give it more exposure and be an excellent promotional tool for the sport.

Other suggestions were to display it in a Cabala like setting. A trailer mounted portable display could also be used to move it to the location of big shoots.

If this isn't resolved soon the whole display will end-up in storage, never to be seen again. Too much time and effort has been put in over the years to let this happen.

I think we can ALL agree it shouldn't be put in storage indefinately. I truely hope a permanent home is found somewhere soon. Just about anywhere would be better than a storage facility that is for sure.

Why not contact the NRA Museum and see if they'd take it on loan for display for X amount of years.

Didn't know Kenny Ray retired. Who took over his spot?

For crying out loud. Fishburn offered 100 grand and deed to property and was turned down. So sad.

From my personal standpoint, the HOF is nothing to me. I would not take the time to visit it if it was right next door. (I have little to no interest in museums of any kind-that's just me).

But, I understand many others feel just the opposite, that it's relevant, that it is important, that it should be somewhere folks can see whatever they've got in there.

So, where?

Many posters here want it at the CC and point out both $ and land were offered for it to be placed there. And the offer was rejected.

Wait a minute. Ohio? The very place where they refused to implement the new catagories, the very place that talks of starting a new organization (read Dysinger's posts) to replace the ATA, the place where "ATA" seems to be a form of profanity (read that great Ohio trapshooting spokesman Nameisjoe's posts)?

Why on earth would the ATA or the HOF ever think of putting anything in Ohio in view of the open hostility, the stated contingency plan to start a new organization and the refusal of Ohio to follow the catagory rules of the ATA?

Again, I don't care where "they" put it or if they put all the stuff in a closet, but if "they" plan to put it somewhere, you'd think they'd put it somewhere at least a little bit friendly towards them. And, given the things being said by Ohio shooters, Ohio seems an unlikely place.

Bob

I don't understand why it isn't being relocated at the WRSC? Wasn't that the plan? Why is it being put in storage?

Straightshooter1

Well said.

Shawn

The best place. The only logical place should be where the Grand is. It may need some help from the ATA, which is only fair. We have a few sheckles in the bank, don't we? I know the ATA and the ATA HOF are, thinnly vailed, seperate entities, but it's all the same family right?

Why not have the ATA donate the money for an HOF building? Unless, of course, there is a long term plan to build a permanent homegrounds elsewhere. If that's the case then we should know about it......right? If not, shouldn't there be?

A traveling version of the museum that could follow the approved Satellite Grands could be an appropriate option... some sort of HOF-mobile?! to promote the ATA and HOF on the road...

Oscar Mayer had its Wiener-Mobile... why can't we have ours?!

I am sure Sparta has a vacant store-front in it's downtown that could be rented for a nominal fee to further anchor the ATA to the community....

Jay

I agree with Straightshooter1.

Maybe before we decide where to put the hall we should think about what purpose we want the hall to serve.

If we just want a place to put the things we have already acquired and add a few things as the years pass, placing the building at Sparta where it will be seen mostly by trapshooters will work.

If we want to use our hall to promote the sport and bring the history of the game to the public, we should consider a site that would get a variety of visitors. Something like the Bowling Hall of Fame in St. Louis. I've been there and I really don't care much about bowling but it was worth the time to see.

A mobile museum is a good idea, but further into the future. Right now we need to make a real important decision on a permanent hall for the sake of the items, and to show proper respect to the people who have donated them.

Maybe the town of Sparta or state of Illinois could match Fishburns offer. After all they signed a 25 year contract extension.

or maybe the ATA should've taken the $100K they invested in the prelim days shootoff and buy their own building? I'll just wait until the storage unit is auctioned off on storage wars someday....

over/under, We Illini already spent 50 million +. It's someone elses turn.

You're the one that said it's the only logical place. I'm just saying that was the offer that was turned down. Couldn't that offer been accepted, and then when funds were available, build it and move it to Sparta? Right now no one gets to see the ATA history. I shoot both places so it really doesn't matter to me. If you can afford 50 million then surely you can afford 200K to build it. And did the ATA ask Illinois to build it, or did Illinois offer to?

Illinois decided to build it whether the ATA came or not. The ATA over sold the participation of the ATA events. Both trust and money is scarce at the WSRC.

Straightshooter1, As a member of the Trapshooting HOF ,not the ATA HOF I might add, and an OSTA director I was fortunate enough to attend sparta with the offer that Jack Fishburn and the OSTA made.

The OSTA offered $100,000 up front and pledged to raise that amount to $250,000. Also Jack in the meeting offered to "give" the trapshooting HOF the deed to what acres they needed for the building at the enterance to the Cardinal Center.

We were told at that meeting that the HOF would be building a HOF building at Sparta, three years have past since then. The last thing that I want to see is the HOF in storage, but that's where it's headed.

On the flip side to the HOF's refusal the OSTA HOF and museum was built and opened last year. The OSTA used some of the money that was offered to the Trapshooting HOF. We are trying to save as much trap shooting history as we can.

Bob, Ohio offerd cash, land, and aguably the best trap shooting destanation in the country. I don't know what more we could have done. Make no mistake if the HOF ends up in storage Ohio trap shooters aren't to blame.

Brad Dysinger 2000 Trap Shooting HOF inductee

Does anyone know whats going on with the HOF? Are they Building at SPARTA? Me my wife and other folks didn't donate parts of of history to set in a warehouse. Surely some decision has been made.

Brad, I disagree.

I don't know (or care) what the ATA or HOF eventually will decide to do about placement of the HOF.

But, I can't imagine any sound business decision that would place all or a part of a business in a city, county or state that is openly hostile to that business.

That's what Ohio has been-openly hostile to the ATA/EC/Sparta as a result of the move relating to the Grand. You stated that you and OSTA had a plan to start your own organization to replace the ATA on this very board. You talked about how Stewart was onboard and ready.

Nameisjoe, who apparently the Ohio shooters on this Board agree with (at least no Ohio shooter contradicted him), said some pretty nasty things about the ATA, Sparta and the EC. You and several others from Ohio said some rather unkind things as well, and OSTA declared it would not utilize the new catagories.

Nameisjoe's nastiness convinced me not to return to the CC again, though I had enjoyed my time at the Classic a couple of years ago. I'll spend my money elsewhere. I don't want to be around people like him and I don't want to listen to something (the Grand, the HOF) that is now history when I am there simply to shoot.

If you are threatening to start a new organization, and you despise the ATA, the EC and Sparta so much, why would you think they'd (the ATA or HOF) have any interest in putting down any roots in your state?

Perhaps, however, they'll surprise me.

Bob

Bob,If you don't care what happens to the HOF why do you bother posting or questioning my motives, I do care, as do the OSTA and Jack, that is why they made the offer that was turned down cold turkey.

How does offering free ground and hundreds of thousand of dollars sound "hostile" to you. I don't care where the HOF builds, but a storage unit isn't a plan. The bottom line is that the offer from the OSTA was a good, honest one that if the HOF would have ran with the possibility of a Storage HOF would have been off the table, and this thread would have been mute.

Brad

The question was "why would the ATA even consider putting anything in Ohio"? The "hostility" is from you & a few others with your negative posts. Maybe when you get your ATA replacement organization up & running you can do whatever you want. How's that working for you by the way?

We can always re-name the Ohio organization the American Trapshooting Association just as it was originally called. I'm sure some of the artifacts were accumulated from those early years and that name would make the transition to Ohio easier.

Besides that, the name Amateur Trapshooting Association no longer applies!!

Brad, I'm not questioning your motives and the reason I posted is that your posts make it sound as if you believe the ATA/HOF "done you wrong" by turning down the offer of land and money to place the HOF at the CC. You sound almost surprised they'd do something like that since it was such a great offer.

My point is, if you continue to say how much you dislike an organization or its management, and that you have another in mind to replace this disliked organization, then that organization is unlikely to want to have anything to do with you.

Perhaps you don't realize what or maybe how you said things. Or, maybe you do. Anyway, reread your post on the ATA/Sparta and Hampton thread on 3/27 at 4:43PM and then read your post on 3/28 at 10:03 PM where you talk about how the Ohio shooters hate the ATA. Read Berlet's post on the same thread where he tells Nameisjoe that he is arguing with idiots (the idiots being any other posters who disagree with Nij about the ATA/Sparta or Hampton).

Jim Bradford is Chairman of the trustees. His opinion will probably decide the fate of the Hall of Fame.

Open the site above for names of the other trustees. Ask them also.

Brad, as you read our past Presidents post above, Neal Crausbay, you can realize he's among many weren't informed of all the offers put forth in Ohio. I have a ton of respect for what Neal Crausbay attempted to do during the cheating era of change from 44 to 34 degree angles yet see he wasn't informed to ALL the offers presented!

It's plainly evident the President of ATA at the time (Tom Acklin) didn't share ALL the information he was privy to within the ranks of ATA!!

For all the good it may do in an attempt to change mind sets, it's past time a true accounting of what really happened in Ohio during the move to Sparta. A few writers on TS from Ohio certainly didn't do much for informing the masses either? Matter of fact, they did more harm than good? The President of the OSTA at the time knows the true story and it should be told to all!

Hap (Vail, AZ)

If the HOF goes to storage, I wonder how many Items will be lost or disappear.

Quick 1 There is alot of vaulable items at the Hof. I know one item which me and my wife donated is worth over $9000 as appraised by three dealers. Hope it is secure.

smsnyder, it seems to me that given the attitudes and actions of the Ohio posters it would be safer almost anywhere than it would be in Ohio. Note that I said "Ohio posters" and not Ohio shooters.

jim brown

Why doesn't the ATA contribute to their own off shoot corporation? It's in our best interest. Isn't it?

jim, That was a stupid post. You are insulting people you don't even know. You should issue an apology on trapwhiners.com.

Setterman, how can I insult someone who won't even divulge his or her name? In any case the posts of anonymous individuals have been total fabrications or, at best, half truths concerning Ohio and the ATA. In my opinion a person who will lie will steal so no apology today.

jim brown

When i was a kid it was cool to see the hall of fame at the Grand. It would be nice if while at the Grand now days to be able to see the Hall of Fame.

With the amount of shooting at Sparta it would be sure to have more visitors than any other spot in the country, isn't that what everyone wants is people to visit the Hall of Fame and see the history of trap shooting?

Matt

jim, Pretty strong words. Calling people liars without having the facts is not recommended where I come from. Please list the lies and who said them.

Setterman, list the names and I will. Not much interested in dialogs with people who hide

jim brown

I'll bet with a bit of co-operation from the other shooting entities that hold big shoots at Sparta, a combined museum could be established. No one wants to foot the bill on their own, but put a few together and the $$ needed becomes a whole lot less.

Face it, shooters are shooters. I would be more inclined to go visit a museum/HOF that had more diversity and I could learn about things I know very little about.

Just some ramblings from a know nothing that has no vested interest into where the HOF/museum is at.

ss

Figures. No facts.

Goodness Gracious you children sure get your britches in a bundle. Name calling, whining, dribble and tripe. Take a look at yourselves. Shame on many of you. I found a 10 year old reading this post. I have now put Trapshooters.com as a blocked site. A 10 year old reading grown (not mature) people getting in a verbal joust. I suggest you take a break, sit in a corner, and take a breath or two. You are crying over something that happened years ago and the finality of it is the HOF had so few visitors that it was a waste of time and effort to keep it where it was. Use business sense not your hearts or broken hearts.

I am certain that if you could go back in time and could watch every step of the process you would realize that a decision had to be made or there would be no ATA. A decision was made and there is an ATA. The Grand may not be in your back yard or it may be in your back yard. Who cares it is where it is. Get in a car and drive. Thousands have driven two lane highways for days to shoot at the grand and now you only have a few minutes on two lane to shoot at the Grand.

Fact..no offer came close to the offer from Illinois, I was there. Fact..no place is better for the office then at the place of the Grand. I hate that we are missing some wonderful people in the old office but we have some very nice people in the new office too and it was not their decision to move. Business moves every day. The ATA is a business. It moved to a less expensive place with the potential for a reduced payrole nearby the place of the largest ATA event. That is a sound business move.

HOF location. I doubt that the HOF will ever be a big draw regardless of location. I could see the building of a site at WSRC as a joint use building...ATA/HOF. I would suggest it be located south of the event center at the WSRC on the south side of Cardinal. Compromise, a site south of the event center would have an address that would be xxxx Cardinal.

Behave yourselves, CA

Figures, afraid to post name.

jim brown

Funny Jim. Post your ATA number and so will I.

John Smith

Setterman, you asked me to prove about the lies. Thank you for providing the proof without any work on my part. Congratulations you are now a proven liar.

jim brown

Ya, I noticed you avoided backing up your Ohio liars claims.

BTW, I would be an imposter, not a liar.

Hosea Emanus

I'm with Quick 1.

Things put in storage tend to "get misplaced" after awhile.

Lets get it on display, somewhere, regardless of who's going to be unhappy.

Regards....Gerald

I agree too. I want it at Sparta but would rather it be at the Cardinal or The Silver Dollar or just about anywhere else if it means saving it from longterm storage. Now if they have a plan where it will not be in storage for more than a year or two max then I say go for it. Somehow I don't think that is the case.

There still asking for donations. Surley, they should let us know what there plans are ? Have they found a location or Not?