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Yardage reduction??

Discussion in 'Uncategorized Threads' started by Frank C, Aug 7, 2008.

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  1. Frank C

    Frank C Well-Known Member

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    I see on the ATA shooter Info center that I rec'd a yardage reduction about a week ago....but I have not rec'd the note in the mail yet....so if it doesn't arrive tomorrow or Saturday, what yardage should I shoot at on Sunday?? The shoot I plan on attending does not have computer access to classify, they just use your average card.
    If I shoot at the old yardage I would be doing so, knowing that it is wrong.....management would not likely take my word about the reduction, so either way I am wrong....????

    What is the correct option?
     
  2. Little Dog

    Little Dog TS Member

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    You have two options: shoot at the yardage your card says or stay home.
     
  3. Little Dog

    Little Dog TS Member

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    P.S. If you decide to shoot, don't get punched from the old (longer) yardage or you'll be screwed.
     
  4. markdenis

    markdenis TS Member

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    If possible contact your state delegate. It could be that your delegate may have enough time to resolve the issue for you.
     
  5. Frank C

    Frank C Well-Known Member

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    1) MIA.....the club does not use a computer

    2) the Delegate is @ the Grand

    3) I should have just gone to Illinois I guess....
     
  6. miketmx

    miketmx Well-Known Member

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    You have to shoot at your old yardage until you get the new card in the mail.
     
  7. Frank C

    Frank C Well-Known Member

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    I think that you are correct MIKETMX....I am putting my hope in the US mail (boy that is really sad) FC
     
  8. phirel

    phirel TS Member

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    This question has been brought to me a couple of times when classifying. My answer has been that the shooter can shoot from the reduced yardage, but if it turns out to be incorrect, the targets will be disqualified.

    Rule VI G 1 states that a shooter must continue to shoot from the last yardage assigned or earned until he/she receives a target review. The target review occurs in Vandalia. There is no mention of how the shooter is notified of the review.

    Pat Ireland
     
  9. Trap4

    Trap4 Member

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    Miketmx--I also agree with you.

    Trap-4
     
  10. Pocatello

    Pocatello Active Member

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    Also the ATA Shooter Information Center has a disclaimer stating that the information should NOT be used for classification. Until you receive hard copy notice, you have not been reduced.
     
  11. BDodd

    BDodd TS Member

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    Could you, maybe too late now, but get e-mail confirmation from Kathy Key to take to the shoot?....Bob Dodd
     
  12. ivanhoe

    ivanhoe Well-Known Member

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    Pocatello that was my thought also but when I went there and checked I could not find it I am not saying it is not there just that I can't find it.

    That is the first thing that I thought of so I went to check. Then I figured I already get myself in enough trouble for jumping in to discussions. That is why I usually do my research first.

    However in the Rulebook I know the last time I quoted the rulebook trying to give someone their options this is what I got "so you take take your rules interpretations on this one and stick it where the sun don't shine!" With that being said here goes.

    "c. If a yardage change is made, the shooter will receive by mail
    a new Average Card with the new assigned yardage noted with
    the word “review.”"

    Know I would take that to mean that what you have seen anywhere else is not notification according to the rulebook. Flame away I am ready but as I see it we have rules some are excellent some are not as good. They are all we have if we choose to ignore one we might as well throw them all out. That makes me a very big supporter of the Book.

    If you choose to break the rules that is fine as long as I don't catch you at it because if I do I will push the issue I promise.

    Bob Lawless
     
  13. markdenis

    markdenis TS Member

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    Bob Lawless

    It was not the quote you recited in the rule book that prompted my response you just mentioned because I agree with you...it was the little smart remark you made at the end of your first post to me,

    "It would seem that when you break or bend one rule they seem to snowball don't they."

    There is no way on this planet a classifier should put someone on the 27 because they do not have a paper card with them when he/she has never been there before...especially at a small local shoot. Oh, and by the way, it is against the ATA rules according to Neil Winston a classifier can not do that.

    Mark Rounds
     
  14. Neil Winston

    Neil Winston Well-Known Member

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    Anybody willing to look it up?

    Neil
     
  15. ivanhoe

    ivanhoe Well-Known Member

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    Well Mr. Rounds that remark was in rebuttal to the fact that if your friend had taken his card with him he wouldn't have had a problem. There are no less than three rules that refer to the same thing. Technically your friend was not in violation of a couple of those rule of his own doing. Still if he had brought his card no change in Handicap Yardage would have taken place there fore no Snowball effect.

    IF you can't understand that with thirty plus years in this sport you deserved that comment.

    Another point to mention is the fact that in a rebuttal that you posted to Pat Ireland you said "Actions by classifiers is why Tommy B. does not carry a paper card anymore." a clear cut admission that the rule was violated deliberately. I am not sorry you were offended by my comment it would seem that by your own words he was guilty of violating the shooter responsibility rule. You made it seem that he forgot his card when he did not.

    Your original post on the thread in question is as follows.

    "Classifying someone many times is very bias and discriminating depending on what state you are from among many other reasons.

    Case in point....last Sunday a friend of mine from Kentucky who shoots on the 24 yard line at present, and has never been past the 26 yard line, was told he had to shoot on the 27 because he did not have his paper average card with him. The shoot was in Evansville, In.

    I am not sure if this action by the classification person was against the ATA rules or not, but it still STINKS BIG TIME and shows what can happen when you give ignorant people a little power!"

    Now I don't find anything in that post that would lead me to believe it was about misclassifying Kentucky shooters all I got was "because he did not have his paper average card with him. The shoot was in Evansville, In." then you later say he doesn't carry his card ANYMORE.

    I did not respond to you after the post about sticking it where the sun don't shine but you came in this thread and started again (if you don't want to get stung don't poke at the nest) leave it alone you already look bad don't prove it. I have never taken any stock in what is said about shooters from any particular state but your unsolicited comments about your friends average card and then the lack of one do not do anything to improve Kentucky shooter standings in the eyes of the shooting community. Please keep in mind I didn't start this crap you did. BTW the first word of your post to me is spelled B-o-l-o-g-n-a.

    To those on this thread I apologize it was not my intension to Hi-Jack this thread.

    Bob Lawless
     
  16. markdenis

    markdenis TS Member

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    Lawless

    You have got to be kidding me! Somehow I believe the President of the ATA over you quote of rules, then later your statement "I don't know for sure" and especially your last one "if you don't want to get stung don't poke at the nest leave it alone you already look bad don't prove it." You can't possible be serious!

    Mark Rounds
     
  17. markdenis

    markdenis TS Member

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    Lawless

    Since my last response to you, I see you have deleted your statement "I don't know for sure." Give it a rest. You have no horse in this race and I am not interested in your opinions based on something you seem to know very little about. I think our state delegate along with Neil if needed will resolve this issue.

    Mark Rounds
     
  18. Frank C

    Frank C Well-Known Member

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    So Bob, looks like I will not bother to shoot at N. Leo this Sunday....for fear of getting "pushed to the limit" or maybe disqualified!!!
     
  19. ivanhoe

    ivanhoe Well-Known Member

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    I most certainly am, as I see it your friend deliberately does not carry a average card you come in here complaining about him being misclassified. If he had showed up at the classification table I work on with out a card he would be put in AA in singles and AA in doubles.

    His yardage I would not attempt to change because I don't have the authority to do so. But the rules say " C. CLASSIFICATION

    1. For 16-yard targets and Doubles, shooters should be placed in three
    (3) or more classes, according to their established average and/or
    known ability. A new shooter may be assigned to any class in 16-yards
    and Doubles events, at the discretion of classification personnel until
    the shooter establishes his/her known ability."

    As far as I am concerned a shooter shows up and no one knows him he has no card and no scores he goes in the class where he won't hurt anyone. BTW the club I am talking about doesn't have a computer

    If you are going to plead his case don't tell everyone he doesn't carry an average card anymore. This by itself is an admission that he has no intention of taking responsibility for his own classification.

    Once again I am serious the club in question had no right according to the rulebook to change his yardage(which I stated in my original post on that thread) I do however stand by what I said about carrying an average card. If it had been a one time thing I would have given him the benefit of the doubt.

    Seeing how you have enlightened us with the fact that he doesn't carry a card anymore. I say he got what he deserved if you don't like it TS.

    Bob Lawless
     
  20. ivanhoe

    ivanhoe Well-Known Member

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    Frank I would say that you might be screwed if you do and maybe screwed if you do. I would say do what you feel is right and best for you. The club will survive with out you. Although we will miss you. LOL

    I put the rule out there for your benefit not for mine. It is just information for you to mull over. Just do me a favor don't get pissed off at me for posting a rule that pertains to what you asked about. Please not like some people do I won't mention any name.

    Frank how can you tell when you got the reduction? I haven't had one in so long I wouldn't know if it tells you or not.

    Bob Lawless
     
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