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wrinkled winchester shells

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by rickk55, Jan 10, 2010.

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  1. rickk55

    rickk55 Member

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    Been having trouble with the claybuster winchester replacement wads when loading winchester cases. They wrinkle and will not crimp correctly, any suggestions would be appreciated, thanks Rick
     
  2. wayneo

    wayneo Active Member

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    Need more info Rick. Which Win. hulls, which CB wads, what powder and how much, weight of shot being dropped, and what reloading press you using? Wayne
     
  3. rickk55

    rickk55 Member

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    For example silver bullet cases, 17 gr. of clays, 1 or 1/8 claybuster winchester replacement hulls, Mec Hydraulic.
     
  4. dverna

    dverna Active Member

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    rickk55,

    I gave up using Claybusters after tweaking for a hour. I use them in STS hulls and use the AA wad in AA hulls. I use a PW800+ for AA's.

    You should also post what type of loader you are using as that may matter.

    I know that paying 50% more to get the factory wad seems expensive but another $30/5000 is well worth trouble free operation for me. Plus the AA wad works very well in my gun.

    I found the Windjammer clone by Claybuster loads without wrinkling the hull.

    Don Verna
     
  5. Hatshooter

    Hatshooter TS Member

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    dusters or downrange make fine wads also
     
  6. shot410ga

    shot410ga Well-Known Member

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    You need to fold-in additional material when pre crimping. This is generaly caused by empty space someplace in the load and/or final crimp being to deep. Check the lenght of the wads (overall). Are you setting them to deep?. The shot column should come up to the inside edge of the pre crimp (looking inside the shell prior to pre crimp). Are you dropping enought shot? Just a few points and questions I have run into in my 35 years of reloading.
     
  7. JTPTM1

    JTPTM1 TS Member

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    i reload winchester greys exclusively for handicap loads. suffered the same problems until i saw a poster printed by mec while shooting in palm beach years ago. 1. increase wad pressure to the point that the wad just fits under the tube 2. first crimp station has to come down enough so that the hole on the top of the shell will not fit a pencil eraser or even smaller. don't mess with second crimp or final stage until you try these first. the problem only seems to be with the greys and handicap loads. i load 20.4 grains solo 1000, claybuster 4118-12b with 1 1/8 oz shot. maybe get 1 or 2 crinklers/100 and i attribute that to wad not seating down far enough due to my not holding down on the pedal long enough. i have a mec hydraulic also. no problem with the reds. you can decrease wad pressure as well. adjust wad pressure so that the wad just fits under the tube.i never get a crinkler with 17.7 grains solo 1000, cb-1118-12, and 1 1/8 oz shot. by the wad just fitting over the tube i mean that with the finfers over the tube the base of the wad just barely clears the guide. may rub sometimes on the 4112-b. nothing against claybuster but some wads are a bit longer or shorter than others. probably due to expansion from heat or cold and/or packaging. just my two cents. joe pires
     
  8. ricks1

    ricks1 Active Member

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    most make a wad now that has a taper on the seal to keep it from catching the inside base of the new type AAs You most likely will have more trouble on a 2 + time fired hull. If you look inside you will see the top of the white base has a burned ring and that will catch the wad when to get to crimp it double sets the wad. CB has a wad that says for taper case dont have the no in front of me.
     
  9. JerryP

    JerryP Active Member

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    flincher100, How does a "wad column" that is too long cause the hull to wrinkle?
     
  10. Frank C

    Frank C Well-Known Member

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    It is the WAD, switch to a NON claybuster and you will be fine....to prove it, find an OLD STYLE AA wad, the old one piece no separate Base Wad.....the Claybusters will work fine in those....
     
  11. Pull & Mark

    Pull & Mark Well-Known Member

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    Or you can call Mec and ask them what you can do with your components and the exact model machine you are useing. Good Luck and Break-em all. Jeff
     
  12. rickk55

    rickk55 Member

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    Thanks for all the great advice.Will keep working until I find the solution. thanks everyone
     
  13. JerryP

    JerryP Active Member

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    rickk55, You have too much crimp or taper pressure.
     
  14. warpspeed

    warpspeed Active Member

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    I had this problem on my P-W. It needed more wad pressure. Problem solved.
     
  15. skeeljc

    skeeljc Supporting Vendor Supporting Vendor

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    When the wad is too long the case mouth folds over the shot charge and when the final crimp die tries to crimp the case it buckles the hull wall because the crimper is trying to lower the closed end of the hull. If you compress the hell out of the wad with the wad seater and then drop the shot and crimp the shell before the wad has a chance to stretch back it will work. The problem with the Claybuster wads is they are made from a vert stiff plastic and are hard to compress. Crushing the hell out of the wad is not the way to make a good reload. By compressing the wad structure you defeat the wad's ability to work properly when the shell is fired.

    The blttom line is you may be able to make it work with a Winchester wad because it will crush and allow the hull to be crimped without buckling the case wall. There is no substitute for having the right wad length. If the wad is right for the load you will not need any wad pressure.

    Jim Skeel
     
  16. DTrykow

    DTrykow Active Member

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    If it's new AA's the trouble is the hull and wad. Certain wads, Downrange, B&P and CB will get caught on the base wad and won't seat all the way causing the wrinkle. Pay close attention to the shot and how high it is sitting in the hull. If it's too high the wad got caught. There is no cure for this believe me. I have 3K New style AA's and tried every combination and trick possible. And no I'm switching to Remington or sending anyone all of my AA's for free. Genuine WinAA's are the only wad that doesn't get caught on the base wad. Old style AA hulls work fine with all wads. Dave T.
     
  17. Frank C

    Frank C Well-Known Member

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    Well said DTrykow, a simple test will confirm, load the "crushed" shell, then cut it open for inspection.....sometimes more wad pressure can help, but in the long run, it is a lot cheaper and a LOT less aggravating to just switch to a different wad. Try the WT-12....
     
  18. rickk55

    rickk55 Member

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    thanks again for all the info,will work on it. thanks again Rick
     
  19. Barry C. Roach

    Barry C. Roach Well-Known Member

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    I suggest you look lower your crimp starter. Get a little more fold started before final crimp. I had the same problem with the latest versions of the AA and that fixed it. Actually, Winchester put a flyer out about is about 10 years ago. Doesn't cost anything to try it.
     
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