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Wisconsin Politicians from a different viewpoint

Discussion in 'Politics, Elections & Legislation' started by Jim Porter, Feb 25, 2011.

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  1. Jim Porter

    Jim Porter Well-Known Member

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    I have my thoughts on the mess going on there as I am sure you do too. I will not give mine but no matter what side you think is right I would love to see someone stick a microphone in the Govoners and members of each house on both parties and ask this question.

    "You are asking for concessions from the working class. What have you given up that is commensirate to what you are asking someone else to give up"? Salary, Benefits, retirement consessions? Anything? If you are truly taking a leadreship role do like the Marines, lead from the front! Put in in writing for our viewers please.
     
  2. shelly

    shelly TS Member

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    Jim, I think you just gave your opinion despite your disclaimer.
     
  3. grunt

    grunt TS Supporters TS Supporters

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    Obamas living large on the taxpayers dime.
    [​IMG]
     
  4. jimrich60

    jimrich60 Member

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    In point of fact, this issue does not deal with much of the so-called "working class", a marxist term by the way. Rather it deals with a very privileged "class" that of government employees (that is, those who suspposedly work for the real "working class", which is, in reality, the taxpayer.

    Second, if you had actually studied the issue, read the bill, and researched issues (rather than, apparently just putting out leftist talking points) the financial impacts of of having to actually pay something towards one's own healthcare and retirement (imagine that-just like most "working class") you would know that those provisions apply to government employees (inside or outside of the unions) and include the Governor as well as other politicians.

    Jim from Wisconsin
     
  5. BAD 303

    BAD 303 Active Member

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    Todays politicians are like foxes guarding the hen house. But the good thing is this is America and you too can get some of that gravy if you want it bad enough. Put your name in the running and get elected. Much like those bad mouthing the rich. They hate those that are a success for any and all reasons.
     
  6. shelly

    shelly TS Member

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    Jim, thanks for that dose of reality. It's nice to see some wheat among all the marxist chaff.
     
  7. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

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    shelly, quote: <i>"Jim, I think you just gave your opinion despite your disclaimer."</i>

    LOL - PWN3D!!!
     
  8. halfmile

    halfmile Well-Known Member

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    4 minutes ago I heard Gov. Walker say he and the legislators would be paying the same costs for pension and health care as everyone else under the budget repair bill.

    I hope that answers your question. (I know it's true cause I saw it on TV.)

    HM
     
  9. halfmile

    halfmile Well-Known Member

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    Oh, yes, I have to add....Rep Van Roy is giving any increase over the last term's salary to charity.

    HM
     
  10. maka

    maka Member

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    No matter what side you are on in the Wisconsin debate the neophte govenor is in the billionares Koch's pocket. This idea of no barganing is splitting the state of Wisconsin wide open. This rift to the Wisconsin society will take years to heal. In addition Medicare reimbersments are on the table with the potetial of selling of public owned power plants. These two issues alone will cost the citizens millions per year in higher health and power related costs. For ssome reason the news media is loosing it focas on all the relevent issues. Mike from Wisconsin.
     
  11. shadow

    shadow Active Member

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    maka, The Gov got a $40,000 donation to his election fund from the Kochs. Got any idea of how much the unions gave the Dems? Just a guess, but I would think MILLIONS !!!!!!!! Now, just exactly who is in whos' pocket ?
     
  12. jimrich60

    jimrich60 Member

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    maka

    Some prank blogger in New York calls Governor Walker, manages to talk to him for 20 minutes, and Governor Walker never realizes it is not one of the Koch brothers-never recognizes the voice, or anything? Although the media carefully ignores this aspect, I think that pretty clearly says that Governor Walker has never dealt with the Koch brothers much, and most certainly could not have any close ties with them, since he cannot even recognize their voices. The Koch brothers gave the Walker campaign $43,000. Less than 1 percent of his donations. Care to guess how many millions the public sector unions gave Walkers opponent? A local senior AFSCME (union) rep, Larry Rodenstein, perhaps inadvertently, let slip the real reason the unions are fighting against the proposed changes (and why the democrats are fighting the bill) when he said to a reporter in Wisconsin "If unions are severely undercut, they won't be able to support (that is, pay for) Democratic candidates." That is what the fight is really about, not the working class, or the taxpayer, or the "kids". Just about unions and big donations to the democrats.

    Jim in Wisconsin.
     
  13. Shooting Sailor

    Shooting Sailor Well-Known Member

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    You are all missing the real point here. You CAN NOT pick and choose who gets to have what rights! You want to take away the right of collective bargaining from a group, based on their employer, yet you scream bloody murder if someone should want to place restrictions on you. Imagine what will happen if next the Wisconsin government decides that they will start registering firearms at an annual cost of $100.00/gun? It is a tactic required to balance the budget, and the public employees have had the right to bargain taken away to balance the budget, so why complain when it is your turn? You were all in favor of balancing the budget on their backs. A truly free society does not remove any right from any group, unless it is from the whole, after reasoned debate and a free vote by the citizens. To me, this smacks of the restrictions placed on the Jews in Germany in the 1930s. It seemed to be reasonable to place restrictions on a group at the start, but once a government starts to reduce the rights of ots citizens, who can tell them to stop? I am not saying that the Wisconsin government are Nazis, but the parallel stands.In a free society, all rights pertain to all citizens.
     
  14. timberfaller

    timberfaller Well-Known Member

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    Public workers unionizing is not a Right.

    Way back when the started talking about unionizing the public workers(city, county, state, Feds)the argument against them going down that road was "collective bargaining"

    Public employee's DON'T have the Right to demand more pay, more pension, more health care! They are getting paid by the private workers

    I am sorry, but if your getting a pay check from any public employment, you don't have a right to unionize. Get rid of the union's!

    Oh ya, as far as Politicians pay, it should a vote of the people what they get!! NOT them telling Us what they will receive!
     
  15. jimrich60

    jimrich60 Member

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    sailor is just comparing apples to oranges (typical leftist tactic) Unions and collective bargaining are not "rights" but privileges extended to public employees in the fifties and sixties. You can search the Constitution from now until forever, and no where will you find the "right" to collective bargaining (unlike and actual God given right to keep and bear firearms, which is enshrined in the 2nd Amendment) Even FDR (a liberal icon) warned against public sector unions as a massive conflict of interest and a danger. Further, what about the "right" of such public employees to pay, or not to pay union dues (which are now automatically and forcibly deducted from their paychecks and given to the unions, whether or not the employee has chosen to join, or belongs to a union? Guess sailor thinks their "rights" don't count. And what about the "right" of the taxpayer (the public employees employer, to decide what the pay and benefits should be? Guess sailor (and libtards in general) don't think the taxpayer has any rights either.

    Jim in Wisconsin
     
  16. shelly

    shelly TS Member

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    Jim, I like you- you are one smart dude.
     
  17. wireguy

    wireguy TS Member

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    It seems the working class pigs are more equal than other working class animals.
     
  18. jimrich60

    jimrich60 Member

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    And, by the way, the federal government eliminated most collective bargaining privileges for federal unions some time ago. This was done by a democrat President and a democrat congress as the unions were starting to severely abuse the collective bargaining process.

    Jim in Wisconsin
     
  19. Shooting Sailor

    Shooting Sailor Well-Known Member

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    If private sector unions can have collective bargaining, then public sector should as well. If you remove collective bargaining from the public sector, there must be a system put in place by which public employees can have some form of bargaing. If public employees are to be excluded from the protection of unions altogether, there should be an alternate means of negotiating with the employer. Dictating to anyone doesn't work well in the long term. Look at the Mid East right now.
    This has become a political issue, rather than one of citizen's rights. Yes, the taxpayer has the right to question public employees pay and benefits, and also to adjust that pay benefit package if necessary, through negotiation, but public employees also have the right to a good wage, comparable to the wages in the private sector. Equal pay for equivalent jobs. I have been on both sides of the fence, and also as an employer, and am known as a right winger, so calling me a liberal doesn't really fly.My point is that in a truly free society, citizens have the rights of free speech, assembly, and association, among others. If you don't believe that, you should read the Constitution.
    I don't believe unions are mentioned in the Constitution anywhere, but you must allow all rights in the Constitution to apply to all citizens. Negotiation will always work better than legislation, especially heavy handed legislation like in Wisconsin.
     
  20. likes-to-shoot

    likes-to-shoot Well-Known Member

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    Jim,, more facts on your last statement please.
     
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