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Winchester Super Cap vs Titegroup

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by Avaldes, Sep 3, 2012.

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  1. Avaldes

    Avaldes Well-Known Member

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    So I have been disecting some silver bullets recently and noticed that the Winchester Super Handicap powder looks a whole lot like Titegroup in appearance. Further it seems to be loaded with around 19.4 grains in my samples. That is at least similar in magnitude to Titegroup, given that the OEM's use a different but similar powder to cannister powders.

    I also noted that the silver bullets use the orange WWT12 wads instead of the white WAA12 wad like the red AA's. This was very interesting because the orange wad is just slightly longer than the white wad and makes a nicer stack up for a dense powder like Titegroup or SuperCap.

    Back to the original question, has anyone had experience with both Titegroup and Winchester Super Handicap powder? I have never tried Win Super Handicap but load lots of Titegroup in STS hulls as a Nitro27 clone and have been extremely happy. It would be really neat to find out that Silver Bullets can be cloned with the same powder. TG is also quite a bit cheaper than SuperCap by the jug. The main facilitator for using Titegroup is having the right wad that is slightly taller than a standard wad that is suitable for say Clays or Green Dot.

    All comments are welcome, especially if you have experience with SuperCap.
     
  2. halfmile

    halfmile Well-Known Member

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    TG all the way for caps.

    Anything that burns for 16 and skeet.

    HM
     
  3. jmac_cope

    jmac_cope Active Member

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    i am a Winchester Super Handicap powder fan. I use the AA HS hulls, Win 209 primers, 20.9 grs of WW super handicap powder, CB 2118 wad and 1 1/8 oz of 7 1/2 shot. I love this load and it shoots well for me.
    I'm with HM in that I'll shoot anything that goes bang for 16 yrd.
    JMAC
     
  4. BigM-Perazzi

    BigM-Perazzi Well-Known Member

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    Winchester Super Handicap powder, 21.5 grains,STS hulls, Win 209 primers, DR version of WJ-12-RPL wad, 1 1/8 #7 1/2 shot. 1255 fps +, under 10,000 psi from Hodgdon's charts.... I seem to remember the AA hulls use the same....
     
  5. Scott Johnson

    Scott Johnson Well-Known Member

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    No experiance with Winchester Super handicap, but two years worth shooting Tite Group for singles and caps. 16 grains for singles and 18.3 grs. for caps. I recently patterned two patterns of 18.3 grains of Tite group agaisnt 21.3 grains of Green Dot, you are not gonna like this but the Green Dot had an edge in both number of pellets in the pattern and a denser core @ 35 yards.So considering a 27 yard bird is shot from 40 to 48 yards, guessing, my caps reloads are now gonna be all Green Dot. YMMV but that is what I found in a limited patterning sample. Green dot powder and hard shot (west coast magnum or STS) make some darn nice patterns in a tight choke for caps, but like I say, you findings may be different. Scott
     
  6. John55

    John55 Active Member

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    Pretty much my own findings as well. Green Dot or PB will out pattern any fast burner for back fence 'caps loads going 1225-1250fps.
     
  7. Avaldes

    Avaldes Well-Known Member

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    Interesting. I found no difference between Green Dot and Titegroup when I patterned them in my gun.

    Anybody have notes on TG vs SuperCap?

    **edited to keep on topic**
     
  8. bigben

    bigben Active Member

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    Avaldes, over my chrony, the standard deviation on a 15 shot string was as follows, Super handicap, 105 fps, titegroup, 49 fps, your results may differ, but I doubt it, less felt recoil, same velocity , within 1%
    I now shoot tightgroup! incinerae em!
     
  9. dontate

    dontate Member

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    I started using Titegroup to mimic Nitro Loads as several people on this site said the powder is the same. I think that Titegroup is the same powder as Winchester handicap powder. It looks the same, has a similar density and to me it seems to shoot similar. I do not think Titegroup is the same powder used in Remington Nitros. It does not look the same nor does it have any of the other characteristics. I load Remington Hulls, Federal Primers, TGT 12 wads and 18gr. Titegroup for 1 OZ. loads and 20gr. for 1 1/8 loads. I used Winchester Handicap powder with the same setup and could not tell the difference except the Titegroup seems to be a bit cleaner overall. I would really like to know exactly what powder Remington uses in the Nitros. I am convinced it is not Titegroup.
     
  10. BigM-Perazzi

    BigM-Perazzi Well-Known Member

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    Remington says it is not...
     
  11. FLIP

    FLIP Member

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    wow 20gr of TG 1 1/8 sounds HOT ! I use 17.3 shows up at 1220fps in a AA hull tgt wad win prim.really like that TG powder
     
  12. John55

    John55 Active Member

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    Just checked Hodgdon's data center and in a AA or STS hull the top load is 18.5grs for 1255 @ 11,500psi. Don't think I'd want to try anything over that.
     
  13. Avaldes

    Avaldes Well-Known Member

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    If you cut open a 1 1/8oz Nitro 27 you will see powder that looks very similar to Titegroup. If you cut open a 1oz Nitro 27 you will see powder that looks NOTHING like TG...composed of flat disks with colored markers. Both charges use the TGT12S wad. This was my experience looking at multiple samples from different lots.

    Remington publically stated that they originally used Titegroup in this incarnation of Nitro 27's with TGT12 wads. They have since gone to an OEM powder that is very close to Titegroup in its properties. NOTE that I made a comment in the original post about Winchester possibly doing the same thing.

    The point of this thread was that I found it interesting that both the N27 and the Silver Bullet AA's use what appears to be similar powder with similar charge weights (~19 grains). I REALLY appreciate BigBen's comments about Titegroup having a better velocity spread than Super Handicap. That might be justification enough to use the Titegroup that I already have.

    Since I have never seen Winchester Super Handicap cannister powder with my own eyes, I have no frame of reference as to its appearance or burning properties. However Titegroup has a very nice clean burn with consistent speeds and consistent drops on my loader. There is nothing to dislike, as long as you have the correct wad for such a dense powder. It seems that the orange AA wad is just the ticket.
     
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