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Why is Sparta so hard in handicap ?

Discussion in 'Uncategorized Threads' started by Texshooter, May 6, 2007.

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  1. Texshooter

    Texshooter Member

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    Last year in the 2006 US Open and National Team Championships there were no perfect scores in Handicap. Durring the entire Grand American there were only two 100's shot (BERKHOUS, CHARLIE and PINTIRSCH, MICHAEL). Singles seems to have a reasionable number of good scores, Why is this such a hard facility to run a perfect score in handicap? AJ
     
  2. Neil Winston

    Neil Winston Well-Known Member

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    Normal midwestern air makes 27-yard shooting right at the edge of what guns can do and shorter-yardage shooters aren't as good as the best 27-yarders.

    Neil
     
  3. j2jake

    j2jake Well-Known Member

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    A new training philosophy, remove all the stakes on your home feild and check your scores. It will make a difference at first. Jake
     
  4. Wilma Harris

    Wilma Harris TS Member

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    Further from Kentucky?
     
  5. shot410ga

    shot410ga Well-Known Member

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    Wind will kill your score at the 27. Especially, in your face wind. There use to be and old saying, "wind in you face means close your case."
     
  6. ronbo142

    ronbo142 TS Member

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    I shot at Brittney yeasterday and we had 20MPH winds. I have found myself in a Trapshooting slump but no reason for a 75 other than the fact that I kept raising my head. But with that said wind and trap is a much great factor to my scores than wind in skeet.

    Ronbo
     
  7. grammie

    grammie TS Member

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    Because the traphouse roofs are higher than normal to allow for pat traps!!!

    A high roof means the angles come out below the edge of the trapshouse instead of above it,,,and it gives you an optical illusion that the targets are very high,,when in fact they are not!!!

    There is your anwser!!!!

    AKA Grammie.........
     
  8. Big Heap

    Big Heap TS Member

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    If the traphouses were built for Pat Traps and not retrofit as most traphouses have to be, why would the roof have to be higher?
     
  9. atagym

    atagym TS Member

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    OK. The traps are lower in the house if that helps you understand it.
     
  10. mastergunner

    mastergunner TS Member

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    How many 100s would make you happy?

    That is why it is a handicap event.

    It has nothing to do with the traphouses. Is this suppose to be another dig on Sparta.
     
  11. clays

    clays TS Member

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    Just my two cents, but I believe the difference is that everyone is trying to make sure the targets at Sparta are LEGAL TARGETS. You will find a lot of clubs with numerous 100 straights that are throwing soft targets.

    Don't beat me up, this is just my opinion.

    Clays
     
  12. Roger Brenner

    Roger Brenner Member

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    Clays, Did you shoot there or are you specutlating? I shot the Grand in August and I thought just the opposite. The targets were set somewhat low and slow-very soft. A soft target is tough to break from the 27 and with a little bit of wind a soft target becomes even more difficult.
     
  13. clays

    clays TS Member

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    stsguy
    I was there at the US Open and the first part of the Grand last year, I agree with you that under certain circumstances a soft target can be more difficult. As I said in my first post (everyone is trying to make sure the targets at Sparta are LEGAL TARGETS.) Sometimes people try so hard they refuse to look at the big picture. I suggest you talk to some of the target setters that were at Sparta last year and you will get the real story and not just my opinion. (again its just my opinion) I did talk to some of the target setters and they were not at all happy with they way they were forced to set targets.

    Clays
     
  14. phirel

    phirel TS Member

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    Patterns shot at 45+ yards can have holes large enough for a target to slip through. As the density of air increases, these holes become larger and more numerous. In denser air, 100 perfectly placed shots from the 27 may not produce a score of 100. This situation becomes less common as the density of air decreases with elevation. Many Western targets are thrown at high elevations in less dense air.

    Pat Ireland
     
  15. Neil Winston

    Neil Winston Well-Known Member

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    Needless to say, Grammie, having never been there, has it completely wrong. The birds come out over the top of the trap, in fact most of the EC went to Sparta in October, 2005, to make sure that's what would happen.

    The birds this year will be legal speed, legal distance, and set by a height pole.

    There are very few perfect scores shot from the 27 - and that's mostly where the members with the skill to break 100 are shooting from - in the Midwest, in contrast to higher elevations where the lesser density of the air promotes tighter patterns and greater shot-speed at the target, which, incidentally, reduces the required lead on a target.

    Neil
     
  16. W.P.T.

    W.P.T. TS Member

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    Pat,

    Your are pointing out the hole in the pattern as though it was and is the same continually (45 Yds and beyond) where that is surely not the case ... The "static" pattern may have a hole in it at that precise point of impact that might not exist slightly closer or slightly farther away from that point of impact ... That plus the fact that there are no two shells exactly alike and probably (?) would not produce a hole in the pattern at the same exact spot twice anyway ... The shot, when in flight is multi dimensional and changes constantly until it hits something or drops to the ground due to the loss of energy ... There is no doubt "Air Density" has an impact on the pattern but at what point does it occur and can we say its constant because of the variation of the shells, I think not ... I do think Neil is right on the money with his percieved perception of not having to lead a target as much in such conditions from what I recall from shooting back in the midwest many moons ago ... WPT ... (YAC) ...
     
  17. phirel

    phirel TS Member

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    WPT- Absolutely no two shells will produce identical patterns. Some may not have any holes and some may have several. The three dimensional aspect of the pattern would increase both the size and number of holes but this is not really relevant. Considering the speed of the shot and the speed of the target, a two dimensional pattern accurately reflects the shot distribution that breaks the target.

    Pat Ireland
     
  18. avidtrapshooter

    avidtrapshooter TS Member

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    exactly don't make it harder and more difficult then it has to be!!! eye on the bird face on the stock thats all there is to it oh and pull the trigger
     
  19. BIGDON

    BIGDON Well-Known Member

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    I guess I will have to test your various theries. Leaving for Sparta tomorrow. Suppose to be damp, now what does that do to the equation??

    Don
     
  20. Dewnys

    Dewnys TS Member

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    I do find it very interesting that there were only two 100 straights all of last year at Sparta. What is even more interesting is that it was done by two unknown shooters, the first was 27 yards and the second was 20 yards. With some of the great shooters (Leo, Kay, Ricky, etc) trying their hardest to put up good scores with huge amounts of $$$ on the line, I would have definitely thought that one of them would surely accomplish the feat. However, I am personally glad that the only guys to "run em" weren't the usual crew. I'm sure that being the first to have 100's at Sparta means alot more to them. I would say this definitely points to Sparta being a difficult place to shoot handicap. As to why this is the case, I'm sure that there are a combination of reasons.

    Sam
     
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