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who is the best on modifying barrels

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by JZ, May 11, 2009.

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  1. JZ

    JZ Member

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    hi i was wondering who is the best to modify a barrel (chokes installation,forcing cones , ported , etc) the only one i know is briley but i want the best thanks
     
  2. Dark Horse

    Dark Horse Member

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    Take a look at www.wrightsgunsmiths.com

    I would trust Stewart to do the very best in Barrel Modifications available anywhere. I have before and would not hesitate to use his services again. Just plain the best at what he does
     
  3. grntitan

    grntitan Well-Known Member

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    Mr. Wright is very good at all you named. I 2nd that vote for him.---Matt
     
  4. JACK

    JACK Well-Known Member Supporting Vendor

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    I hope you think twice about modifying your bbl. Usually when you modify a bbl as you suggest you desire to, you pay for the service performed on the front end and pay for it again in overall gun depreciation when you go to sell it. I am not personally down on porting but most on the forum are. And too most of those that hve an opinion about porting rate the "Seitz" pattern as the one they abhor most. Adn yet Allems still does that pattern. Forcing cone work is a no brainer. Don't you think that if bbl makers could reduce recoil by lenghtening the forcing cone they would do it at the factory? It has no affect.

    Backboring is a fave of bbl smiths and it does have a tendency to disperse the center cluster (dense center area) into the outer areas of the pattern. I agree with that. But most good coaches and knowledgeable shooters prefer the dense core as it helps you center your pattern. I will not start the target chips direction argument again, but it is obvious to me when I "am in the center". Some shooters think these bbl changes will give them less recoil. Although I doubt it, if you are really having recoil issues, add a Bumpbuster, a RAD, or a Gracoil recoil device. They make shooting a pleasuere where you once had apprehension. And of course the time honored fix to recoil is lighter loads and/or slower burning powders. Me? I prefer a .725 bbl, and .030 to .033 const. and loads that compliment my game. Adn I use a RAD.

    If you are having bbl work done it is often said that Wilkinson will acceopt your bbl, polish it up a bit in the choke and send it back with a substantial bill. While I do not belive that specifically, it is likely true that he puts a pattern on paper, declares it good and charges you so you can claim his bbl work.

    Still, I would rate him tops and Allem, and Allor as top flyte bbls smiths that will give you a dispersed shot pattern.

    And since I have taken the time to give you a substantial answer and opinion, how about coming back on the thread and tell us wht you think so we know how to proceed further. I hate guys that post threads and walk away.
    If you want tubes, go wiht Wrights or Briley or Angle port

    Jack
     
  5. zzt

    zzt Well-Known Member

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    jz, who will do the best job depends on what you think is important, and what you want out of it. Personally, I would only use a barrel smith who actually patterns your barrel(s) and choke(s) before and after. As far as I know, there are three smiths that do that. They are Eyster, Wilkinson and Allor. Eyster does the least patterning. Allor is downright compulsive about patterning.

    There are many on this forum who will not purchase a used barrel that has been modified in any way. The reason is you cannot trust the work was done right. I am on of those, except if the work was done by one of the three I mentioned. I have owned and shot Wilkinson and Allor barrels. All were/are superb. Of the two, I prefer Allor because of his fanaticism, his results, and the stunning superb finish he puts on the cones, bores and chokes.

    If your barrel is good and throws even, dense patterns, a good smith probably cannot improve on that much. A bad smith can literally ruin your barrel (performance wise). If you are unhappy with your barrel's performance, call each of the three. They each have a slightly different approach.
     
  6. PerazziBigBore

    PerazziBigBore TS Member

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    First.. I see no need in just sending a barrel to be played with.. UNLESS you know what it is lacking.. have you put it on paper??? Is the pattern good.. ?? Is it what you want??? If the answer to these questions are yes.. than keep it at home.. Now.. if you bought a O/U barrel choked .008/.012 and want to shoot bunker.. then you must choose how to get more choke... Backbore??? if there is enough metal.... Choketubes???? Maybe you want your POI regulated for doubles to be maybe 70/30---50/50... This is where your barrelsmiths really shine.. The 2 barrelsmiths I use are Stu Wright and Tom Wilkinson... Both are excellent.. Either of them can give you a "Hot" core or a more uniform pattern.. Which do you perfer???

    I do caution you.. more barrels have been screwed up.. almost beyond repair by a myrid of so called barrelsmiths.. Be VERY careful where you send your work to..

    As I continue to play with many shotguns..I'll need the expert work of barrelsmiths now and then.. Be glad we have them in our country..and it is a art form.. In Europe its next to impossible to get barrels tweeked to perfection.. I have heard Fabbri sends their barrels to Tom Wilkinson..If anyone knows for sure.. please chime in.. All Good.. Mike
     
  7. 1brucem

    1brucem TS Member

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    MIA is out in left field when it comes to Wilkinson. I have sent my barrels to him, they come back shooting better patterns, softer shooting, and are spot on as far as poi. Just look at the list of All Americans who use his services! I and others would pay more for guns that have been Wilkinson tuned but we are trap shooters looking at trap guns. Bruce
     
  8. PerazziBigBore

    PerazziBigBore TS Member

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    Hey Bruce.. I think one of the biggest problems is.. even with a name on the barrel.. you never know who followed... You call Tom and ask him what barrel #XXXXX had done.. He tells you it left at .022/.032 with a .738 bore.. and you are now looking at a .740 bore with .015/.021 chokes...

    A call to Tom.. or any of the great barrelsmiths will let you know what it should be..when they had the barrel.. So few of us do that.. or even shoot a barrel before buying it..
     
  9. Neil Winston

    Neil Winston Well-Known Member

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    Remember that a less hot core means you will have to shoot without any delay at all. If you can't do that, don't modify the barrel if it's a factory full choke. The theory that more pellets are in the pattern is unproven in my experience.

    Neil
     
  10. JACK

    JACK Well-Known Member Supporting Vendor

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    Brucem. I am wrong to repeat hearsay. Yes I agree with that. But tell me... What cna yo do with a .735 bbl that has.033 choke already in it from the factory? Pellets deform at ignition. And those get out of the pattern. Wilkinson cannot hold them in. Adn I would pay less for a Wilkinson bbl. IN fact, not at all. And the reason is I like the balance of full thickness bbls vs the thinner walled back bored guns.
     
  11. hmb

    hmb Well-Known Member

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    MIA,

    Mr. Wilkinson can take that barrel and make it better. He has a unique way of altering the inside dimensions of the barrel in the area of the forcing cone and choke. The finished product is better than the factory original. Believe it or not. HMB
     
  12. Neil Winston

    Neil Winston Well-Known Member

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    Harry, could you be a bit more specific about what "better than factory original" means? What's better about them, and is there any respect in which they aren't better? In other words, is it really possible that there's no performance price to pay anywhere and it's all plusses up and down the list?

    It would be nice to know too how you know.

    Neil
     
  13. hmb

    hmb Well-Known Member

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    Neil,

    A friend of mine whenever he gets a new gun sends it off to Wilkinson for fine tuning. I miked it before and after he sent it off. The two major differences when it came back were the forcing cone and the fixed choke. The dimensions were different and the shape was different.

    It appears to me that the forcing cone design reduces the amount of shot deformation and the change made to the choke helps keep the pattern together and increases uniformity.

    I have done no testing of the barrel, but I have watched my friend shoot many 100s with it. HMB
     
  14. Two Dogs

    Two Dogs Well-Known Member

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    Kerry Allor
     
  15. JerryP

    JerryP Active Member

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    "I have done no testing of the barrel" That is the way it always is. People line up to praise these guys but it is always the SOS.

    I am also skeptial these barrelsmiths are actually testing these barrels. At least not a meaningful test like Neil Winston would perform. It is time consuming and would have to be cost prohibitive.
     
  16. JZ

    JZ Member

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    hey tahnks all for the answer all of this has come to my mind because im about to purchase a perazzi mx2000 but both of the barrels has fixed full chokes , so i plan to getting into olymic trap so i need the bottom barrel to have chokes in it ...... so when i send my barrel im sure its going to be a lot of options to deal with thats why i make this post thanks
     
  17. zzt

    zzt Well-Known Member

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    jz, I did the same thing you are considering. I had my lousy performing MX-2000 O/U barrels turned into fixed choke bunker barrels. You really need to talk to Allor or the Eyster brothers. Eyster is a darling of the Olympic Trap crowd. Allor did my fixed choke bunker barrels. They are superb. He uses a different choke profile for bunker than he does for ATA (doubles). Wilkinson uses the same profile as he uses for ATA, he just makes the chokes tighter.

    You really do have to talk to each of them to decide what you want to do. Each will tell you what they do and why.
     
  18. Neil Winston

    Neil Winston Well-Known Member

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    hmb, thank for your response, which I think is exactly the way you see it. The gun shoots great now.

    But I have to point out that you have not answered my question. It was, edited

    Harry, could you be a bit more specific about what "better than factory original" means? What's better about them . . .?

    And since you didn't test the barrel before (or after for that matter) you really can't say it's better, can you? It's fine now and we agree on that . . . but how do you _know_ that the forcing cone and choke modifications made it better? When I tested a very good 870 barrel after impressive forcing -cone work it didn't shoot any any better than it did before with what anyone would call an "abrupt" forcing cone.

    Neil
     
  19. JACK

    JACK Well-Known Member Supporting Vendor

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    I have a good friend. Jerry Demulling. Friend to many, but I live near Jerry and Cheryl. Jerry believes in Wilkinson. I ma not sure he would allow a test since he shoots his Wilkinson so well, but I have several unmodified Perazzi bbls to use as comparison. But Neil has done all this before. If Jerry wants to offer his I will offe rmine. But based on how much confidence (think Wilkinson) has to do with shooting he iwll prob say no. I do not faultl him fo rthat.
     
  20. Neil Winston

    Neil Winston Well-Known Member

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    zzt, correct me if I'm wrong, but I recall asking you to actually pattern-test a barrel before you sent it out to your most recent tuner. You declined, as I recall, saying it would be "like comparing apples and oranges."

    Now don't you wish you had that data so you could answer these questions?

    Also, while I'm at it, and this it to anyone who may care to respond - and I'm serious, I've never gotten anywhere with any of this:

    1. What's "pattern uniformity?" Specifically, and how would I recognize it when I saw it?

    2. It it the same as "even" and, again, could you give me an example? A real example is preferred over a theoretical one.

    Does anyone have a barrel which was tested on either of those criteria: uniformity or evenness - before barrel work and after and so can tell us what the effect on those two variables was? Anyone?

    Neil
     
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