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Where did the 90% of Americans favor UBC come from

Discussion in 'Politics, Elections & Legislation' started by Big Al 29, Apr 8, 2013.

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  1. Big Al 29

    Big Al 29 TS Member

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    Many of the news agencies are saying 90% of Americans want Universal background checks.

    I understand its BS and the news is attempting to sway the Hill to heed what the "population" wants.

    I was ust wondering where the data comes from. No one called or polled me about what I think.

    Is it another 2000 person poll that doesn't mean squat when we have 300 million that live here.
     
  2. Martinpicker

    Martinpicker Active Member

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    They will actually poll only 100 people to get this kind of result. Then report a plus or minus factor of only 5%. Ridiculous. Martinpicker
     
  3. 548

    548 Guest

    What's funny is the gun shops have jumped on the background check and madatory FFL transfers bandwagon. Apparently the thought of charging transfer fees has made them reconsider their position regarding the "infringed" language.
     
  4. darr

    darr Well-Known Member

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    Hey 548,welcome to the party.Very lucid,thoughtful,concise,and TRUE statement.


    Darr
     
  5. coyote1234

    coyote1234 Member

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    How can 90% of Americans support "background checks" when they don't even know what a "background check" is?

    Ask someone who supports background checks what questions will be asked?

    Ask them what government databases will be tapped for information?

    Ask them what happens when the government makes a mistake and denies a citizen a gun?

    Ask them if they want their private information from their doctor, minister, psychiatrist, teacher, or employer made available for "background checks"?

    After everyone knows the answers lets see if 90% still support it.
     
  6. JT 27

    JT 27 Member

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    Any survey can be skewed by picking the sample population. All surveys are done from statistical data. Sample size controls the accuracy. IE: If you want a 100% of people in favor of Gay Marriage, your population would be chosen from Fire Island on a summer weekend or Key West in the winter. You want 100% pro gun control, go to Sandy Hook, Cn. These are the ploys the media uses, they darn sure would not take a gun control survey in west Texas.
     
  7. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

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    I believe the figures in this article are also on the inflated side, but they are NOWHERE near the 90% figure that is so skewed as to be a lie. The highest figure this poll showed was 58$ in the Northeast. One of the major flaws with these polls is that they often do not canvas gun owners. Gun owners are one group that takes privacy seriously, to the point of blocking of screening calls, thus having less change of being polled.

    Politics Counts: The Cultural Divide Over Guns

    Dante Chinni is the writer of Politics Counts , which runs every Friday. Mr. Chinni is the author of Our Patchwork Nation, which examines different types of communities across the U.S.

    For many, Washington’s stalemate over gun control is viewed as just another example of “broken Washington.” Republicans, supported by the National Rifle Association, oppose gun control efforts. Democrats, supported by anti-gun lobbies, favor it. The result is no movement.

    But the real story is more complicated than that. When you get down to it, guns and gun control are cultural issues in the United States. They are about where people live and the values and traditions they grew up around. Go through most sets of numbers on guns and gun control, from polling figures to actual real-world data, and a few trends repeat themselves.

    In the broadest terms, regionally speaking, the gun control debate is about the states in the East and West versus the states in the South and Midwest.

    February data from the Pew Research Center illustrate the divide on the question of whether people think it is more important to “protect the right of Americans to own guns, or to control gun ownership.” In the Northeast, the 58% of those polled favor “control gun ownership.” In the West, 52% favor the control answer. But in the South and Midwest, people favor gun rights, albeit by small margins.
    <br>
    Region<br>
    Favor Control<br>
    Favor Rights<br>
    <br>
    Northeast<br>
    58% Favor Control<br>
    37% Favor Rights<br>
    <br>
    Midwest<br>
    45% Favor Control<br>
    50% Favor Rights<br>
    <br>
    South<br>
    48% Favor Control<br>
    49% Favor Rights<br>
    <br>
    West<br>
    52% Favor Control<br>
    44% Favor Rights<br>
    <br>
    Again, remember those numbers are from February, during the middle of a serious gun control debate with the Newtown, Conn., school shootings hanging in the air — a time one would assume the feelings for “control” might be higher than usual. The regional attitudes, however, are largely consistent over time. People in the South and Midwest favored gun rights by a larger margin in Pew numbers from last spring before the movie-theater killings in Colorado or the shootings in Connecticut.

    But the regional and state differences in gun culture are visible beyond attitudes toward gun control. They are apparent in numbers on gun ownership, where, again, levels are much higher in the Midwest and South, according to Pew data. And they can be seen in the number places one can buy a gun in each region.

    Politics Counts went through the Federal Firearms License database this week and saw the same divide. The number of gun dealers per 100,000 residents in the Midwest and the South is 51 and 43 respectively. In the Northeast and West those figures are 35 and 37 per 100,000 residents.

    In other words, there are sharp differences in the role guns directly play in the everyday lives of people in different states and regions – how many gun stores are nearby and how many guns are in people’s homes – and those differences extend into politics.

    You can see the splits more clearly at the state level. Eight of the 10 states with the highest number of gun dealers per capita consistently Republican in their presidential vote. Consider Missouri and Arkansas, both are reliably Republican (Missouri Sen. Claire McCaskill’s surprising 2012 win notwithstanding) and both are far above average in their gun dealers per 100,000 people – 100 and 67 dealers per 100,000 residents respectively.

    At the other end, the seven states with the lowest number of gun dealers per capita are all solidly Democratic in presidential elections. New York and California, two big states that are regularly part of the Democratic presidential coalition, are extremely low in the number of gun dealers per 100,000 residents – 20 and 21 per 100,000 residents respectively.

    And those differences in gun culture have real impacts in state legislatures around the country.

    As the Journal reported earlier this week, since the Connecticut shooting in December, 14 state legislatures have passed laws that would weaken existing guns rules. Ten of those 14 states are in the Midwest or South as defined by Pew and the U.S. Census. Eleven of them voted for Republican presidential nominee Mitt Romney last November. And all of them, except Utah, are above the national average for the number of gun dealers per capita.

    The point is that the red/blue political split doesn’t get in the way of gun control. Rather, the cultural divide over guns is a driver of the country’s red/blue political split.

    The distinction may not matter much in terms of the end result in the current gun control debate in Congress. A stalemate with little change seems likely. But the cultural divide on guns explains why it’s difficult to change federal gun control laws.

    It’s not just about lobbyists and arm-twisting. The two sides in the debate are dug in. Where guns are concerned, they live in different places and in different realities.
     
  8. Birddogfella

    Birddogfella Member

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    They are all living in Northern Virginia, vote democommie, and fear us gunowners south of 'em!
    olde pharte
     
  9. Big Al 29

    Big Al 29 TS Member

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    I would just love to ask Brian Williams and the other liberal media where the "90% of the population favor UBC" come from, who was polled, how many people were polled and what is the SD?

    Joe Uninformed Taxpayer sees this garbage on the TV and like the sheep most are they buy it like everything else they see on TV. If its on the news, its got to be true.

    Sad
     
  10. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

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    Re: Gunshops supporting background checks...

    Not every gunshop supports them. Those that do are usually putting profits before rights, though there are a few anti-gun Fudds who own gunshops (we've had a couple here).

    I noticed many years ago that whenever the local media wanted to get a gunshop owner to sanction anti-gun legislation, they always went to the anti-gun Fudd gunshop and got him some air time. They never went to the shops of the pro-gunners, because they weren't useful tools.
     
  11. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

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    Where does the 90% come from? From the Joseph Goebbels play book.
     
  12. timberfaller

    timberfaller Well-Known Member

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    Who practices propaganda??

    The alphabet news media
    The Puffington Post
    ALL news sources that end with the word "Times"
     
  13. cyduster

    cyduster TS Member

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    The Quinnipiac University Poll, directed by Douglas Schwartz, Ph.D., conducts public opinion surveys in Pennsylvania, New York, New Jersey, Connecticut, Florida, Ohio, Virginia and the nation as a public service and for research.

    "and the nation" Male Bovine Excrement!

    Larry
     
  14. rpeerless

    rpeerless Well-Known Member

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    CT has UBC and finger printing. But it's never enough, progressives want more and more and more. Countless pages of paperwork already. Takes an hour or more to make a purchase with all the paperwork in order.
     
  15. TinMan88

    TinMan88 TS Member

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    President Obama recently gave a speech in Colorado regarding the new gun laws that have just been passed. As always Mr. Obama tried to give the impression that he had the support of everyone and their brother as he had the local police force set up behind him.

    That same day the county sheriff made a video ridiculing such a stunt and supporting the second amendment. We need more like him to take a stand.

    What should be concerning people about this speech is the fact that this President is the only president in U.S. history that seems to complain about the constitution limiting the powers of government. He said plain as day while mocking gun owners for being weary of government overreach that he is constrained by the system our founders put in place.


    It is NOT "about the cheeldren".
     
  16. GBatch_25

    GBatch_25 Active Member

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    Would someone please explain to me the difference between filling out a 4473, running a NICS check, and complying with the waiting period (if applicable) and running a 'universal background check'. Truly, I'm not stupid, but I plead ignorance.

    Is UBC just another focus-group-tested term that the left has adopted for use so that ignorant folks will agree to it in polls ?

    Gene in Illinois
     
  17. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

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    Gene, the UBC that is being pushed would require a 4473 and NICS check for all transfers, including gifts to family members.

    We're trying to get details, but it may preclude loaning a gun, including test firing someone else's shotgun at a trap range, without a background check.

    But one thing it does it not require is for the feds to destroy the NICS info after a certain length of time. This is the most onerous detail - the keeping of a permanent database. This is de facto gun registration and is the main reason to oppose this bill. This legislation is a Trojan Horse.
     
  18. 548

    548 Guest

    NICS is only as good as the information supplied to it. It has been well documented that there are a great number of states not even submitting data. This, in my opinion, is problem number one. I would think that any new legislation would include language requiring states to comply by submitting the required data.
     
  19. GBatch_25

    GBatch_25 Active Member

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    Not being argumentative, just trying to think this through.

    So, we NOW have some states not submitting info to NICS. We also have, by the AG office's admission some 40,000 people who have filed errant 4473s, but those people are not prosecuted. etc.

    Under current law my understanding is that the type, model, serial # of the firearm is NOT submitted by the local FFL to State or Federal authorities at the time of transfer or purchase. It is maintained on the 4473 form which is in the FFL's file cabinet(s). Unless you or I specifically ask for a copy of it, that's where it resides. I've never asked so can't say whether my FFL would give me a copy or not. Here in Illinois, every firearm transferred from out -of-state requires a 4473. In-state transfers don't, but the buyer and seller are required to draw up papers with identification info as well as make, model etc. Antiques are excluded from the 4473 process.

    I can see that it might be a PIA to have a FFL transfer a firearm to your nephew or son, or even for an in-state transfer; but doesn't current law require a FFL transfer now if it's a gift, whether to a family member or not ? Or, can I just give a pistol to my brother-in-law when he visits me if I live in Illinois and he lives in Ohio ?

    I can see the objections to a national database. I get that.

    Do you have the Senate Bill number or the comparable House version ?

    Gene in Illinois
     
  20. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

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    Many states do not supply any info to NICS because they do their own background checks.

    Oregon, for example, does its own background checks for long arms and handguns. NICS is not involved. So why should info be sent to the feds?
     
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