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What's going on here?

Discussion in 'Uncategorized Threads' started by AJKohler, Nov 25, 2008.

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  1. AJKohler

    AJKohler Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
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    I'm currently selling a number of guns on Gunsamerica, and I'm going through a very odd experience. I'm wondering if anyone here has had a similar thing happen to them.

    One woman contacted me about first three, then four of my guns, saying she was interested in them. Urgently wanted to contact me directly. Constantly claims to be a 'very busy woman.' She's looking at a Winchester 94, a SAA copy, a Rossi Coach gun, and an Australian Defense Industries 1887 copy - an odd combination, to say the least.

    I gave her a total including shipping of $3300, which she agreed to. Saturday, I get a check Fedexed from (allegedly) a client of hers for $6000, with instructions to ship immediately (no FFL) and remit the excess by Moneygram. I told her - the purported buyer - that I do not do Moneygrams, I do not refund excess payment, I do not ship before the funds have cleared and cannot ship without a copy of the receiving FFL. What should I do with the check? She said just cash it and refund the difference. I repeated that I do not refund overpayments. Now she says just go ahead and cash it, she is not going to add another of the guns I'm selling, she just 'needs one for defense.'

    One for defense? She's purportedly buying four guns, three of which would not be my choices 'for defense.' WTH is going on here? I know about the scams of here's a bunch of money, ship and remit the excess, and then the check bounces. But I've made it very clear that I'm holding the guns until the money clears. As well as that I will not ship until I've gotten a copy of the FFL, because I'm shipping from one on this end. What have I missed, what is my exposure, and what is going on? This one is pushing a lot of buttons, but there is nothing I can quite put my finger on, if nothing happens before the check clears.

    Tony
     
  2. tachyon

    tachyon Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    670
    The check will eventually bounce. Sometimes the bank will credit your account for the amount of the check and it can take a month before the complete transaction/bounce will happen.

    I am 99% sure this is a scam. Contact your bank, tell them what is happening. Contact local law enforcement. She knows the check is worthless and is hoping you will either send her some money or some guns. Do not do either.

    Sometimes law enforcement will ask you to try to return the check to her. If she gives a real return address then they can try to apprehend the culprit. Usually they will provide a phony return address
     
  3. Diamond Grade

    Diamond Grade TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    86
    Sounds like a scam from the word go. I would not sell her anything period, just my two cents. Ron
     
  4. dsid01

    dsid01 TS Member

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    Sep 18, 2007
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    If I were you I would'nt cash the check I've heard of people doing this to get your bank account info and wiping you out before you know it.
     
  5. Savage99Stan

    Savage99Stan Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2007
    Messages:
    1,081
    This is an ongoing scam run offshore and virtually untraceable. I had advertised a truck toolbox and a truck camper a few years ago and got "bids" on each from someone who "shopped" for others and wanted to send me a special "fast acting" check which didn't need to have me wait to cash it and which would include enough money for the item, shipping, and money for me to immediately send back to him for his commission. I turned it over to both the Tradin' Post people as well as the BBB. They both told me that they got many calls on this one and that there was virtually no way to find or catch up with the perpetrators. The message, I'll bet, was written in a stilted way, full of religious references and blessings, and if read out loud, would sound like the kind of wording you'd expect to hear on a phone helpline from Bombay. My first one, on the toolbox, I had answered by saying I'd not ship, and had no pictures. The "buyer" responded that his client loved the pictures and went on with the B.S. purchase proposal. The next one, on the camper, started the same way. Tradin' Post folks said almost everyone advertising anything that week got one. Must also be computer generated.
    Avoid these like the plague.
    Stan
     
  6. flamborn

    flamborn TS Member

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2008
    Messages:
    53
    As said it's a scam. The check is fraudulant, probably stolen. Send it back or contact local law enforcement. If she mailed it and you still have the envelope the USPS authorities might even investigate it.
     
  7. shadow

    shadow Active Member

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    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
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    Since you are selling GUNS and this "woman" is making an attempt to purchase them it might be best if you contacted the ATF. They would be more apt to trace down the the scammer and arrest "her" for the fraud it is.
     
  8. over the hill

    over the hill Active Member

    Joined:
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    Some years ago a friend of mine got roped into the same thing when he sold his fathers 64 Mustang. The greed factor cost him. The ckeck was bogus and the Mustang was never seen or heard of again.

    The same type of scam Im sure.


    Regards....Gerald
     
  9. jhoward

    jhoward Member

    Joined:
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    There are several known scams using this type process. As noted above the check will bounce and you will be out any overage funds you send and any items that you might send them. I believe its gotten to be a fairly common thing on Ebay, but I've never heard of it on a firearms site before. Not sure if this would involve the ATF or not, but they will almost always use FedEx/UPS/Western Union because using the post office turns the crime into a federal mail fraud charge and gets the FBI involved.
     
  10. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

    Joined:
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    25,238
    Location:
    Deplorable Bitter Clinger in Liberal La La Land
    As stated above, if she mailed you the funds, this is mail fraud. Contact your local postal inspector. Do not shrug this off. She's going to do the same thing to someone else, and no doubt has done it before.
     
  11. spritc

    spritc Active Member

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    Location:
    Indiana
    This is one of the oldest scams out there. Contact USPS and let them know what you have. Under no circumstances send them anything, guns or money.

    Steve
     
  12. stokinpls

    stokinpls Well-Known Member

    Joined:
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    Go ahead and cash it. The BEST that could possibly come out this deal is you will owe your bank (or whomever you choose to cash it) $6000. If you really want to lose, send the guns too, especially to a non-FFL so they can nail you for that too. 4 guns lost forever, out $6000 to the bank and BATF violations for sales to a non-FFL. Go for it.

    If this was a troll, congratulations, from all of us.
     
  13. ivanhoe

    ivanhoe Well-Known Member

    Joined:
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    Messages:
    7,538
    Location:
    Oxford MA
    AJKohler I am wondering how are you in contact with her? You keep saying she said ,she told me, I told her. Is any of this communication on paper or is she calling you by phone? If she is writing or calling you it would seem to me you have options.

    Has she given you a shipping address? There has to be a way that you can build up a little evidence before you go to the police or postal authorities such as

    Phone number if you have them

    Address if you have them

    The bank that the Check is drawn on.

    All and any of these things will aid the authorities in finding out what and where this is all coming from. IMO this is definitely a Scam and if you are going to go to the authorities do not communicate with this person any more unless they ask you to.

    Bob Lawless
     
  14. GunCSI

    GunCSI TS Member

    Joined:
    Dec 30, 2007
    Messages:
    42
    The check is a fraud, do not cash it. They are printed out by the scammer and if you'll check the address of the financial institution that's printed on the check something like Yahoo yellow pages, the address on the check will probably be close but not quite the same as the real address. There is no such account and if you cash it, you'll get stuck a returned check fee. Want to check for sure? Call the bank that supposedly issued the check and give them the routing number.
    Call whoever the check was sent through (UPS, USPS) and report it to them. Also report it to the local law enforcement. Hope you haven't handled the check too much so maybe they'd have a shot at some prints. Keep screwing them around and emailing back and forth and pretty quick the name and state of who you're supposed to put on the Moneygram will change.
     
  15. AJKohler

    AJKohler Member

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    Thanks for all the help, people. This has been an email conversation with her, and there have, as suggested, been several addresses offered - all on the East Coast. And yes, teh check came via Fedex, not USPS. I am being told repeatedly to cash it, even though I have been very specific that I will not take a check for more than the amount, will not refund overpayments and so on. So I guess I'm going to call one of the local detectives and see where he recommends I take it from here.

    Too many hinky alarms were going off.

    Tony
     
  16. shooterIII

    shooterIII Member

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    Location:
    MN (state of socialism)
    Keep us posted.
     
  17. bobdog

    bobdog Active Member

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    Ran across this today on Craig's list, although it basically echoes what everybody else is telling you:

    "FAKE CASHIER CHECKS & MONEY ORDERS ARE COMMON, and BANKS WILL CASH THEM AND THEN HOLD YOU RESPONSIBLE when the fake is discovered weeks later."

    Post back and let us know what happens.
     
  18. ivanhoe

    ivanhoe Well-Known Member

    Joined:
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    7,538
    Location:
    Oxford MA
    While we are on the subject of scams a friend of mine sent this to me it is a warning about returning phone calls in unknown area codes. It has been confirmed by Snopes which is not etched in stone. It is also supposed to be confirmed by ATT but so far all I am getting is a maintenance statement. I would not want to chance it at those prices.

    Bob Lawless

    This has been verified by both AT&T and Snopes!

    http://www.snopes.com/fraud/telephone/809.asp

    IMPORTANT INFO ABOUT AREA CODE

    We actually received a call last week from the 809 area code. The woman said 'Hey, this is Karen . Sorry I missed you--get back to us quickly. I have something important to tell you.' Then she repeated a phone number beginning with 809 We didn't respond.

    Then this week, we received the following e-mail:
    Do Not DIAL AREA CODE 809, 284, AND 876 THIS IS VERY IMPORTANT INFORMATION PROVIDED TO US BY AT&T. DON'T EVER DIAL AREA CODE 809

    This one is being distributed all over the US . This is pretty scary, especially given the way they try to get you to call.

    Be sure you read this and pass it on.

    They get you to call by telling you that it is information about a family member who has been ill or to tell you someone has been arrested, died or to let you know you have won a wonderful prize, etc.

    In each case, you are told to call the 809 number right away.. Since there are so many new area codes these days, people unknowingly return these calls.

    If you call from the U.S. , you will apparently be charged $2425 per-minute.

    Or, you'll get a long recorded message. The point is, they will try to keep you on the phone as long as possible to increase the charges. Unfortunately, when you get your phone bill, you'll often be charged more than $24,100.

    WHY IT WORKS:

    The 809 area code is located in the British Virgin Islands (The Bahamas).
    The charges afterwards can become a real nightmare. That's because you did actually make the call. If you complain, both your local phone company and your long distance carrier will not want to get involved and will most likely tell you that they are simply providing the billing for the foreign company. You'll end up dealing with a foreign company that argues they have done nothing wrong..

    Please forward this entire message to you r friends, family and colleagues to help them become aware of this scam.

    AT&T SAYS TRUE
    http://www.att.com/gen/press-room?pid`45


    SNOPES SAYS IT'S TRUE:
    http://www.snopescom/fraud/telephone/809.asp
     
  19. maclellan1911

    maclellan1911 TS Member

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    Messages:
    4,226
    tell her to beat feet, take all the emails and what info you have Email her with your intentions to turn it in or have her buy and send a registered return mailer for you to send the check back. Shes asking you to send with out a FLL??????? I sold 2 guns on line 1 was a complete mess. After thatt I sold the next one MY ffl to theirs....... My FLLs funds to theirs. cost me 50.00 with shipping on my end. 2 years ago, price up im sure. NO FLL no deal. Return the check with a letter, make phot copy of both send check back certified mail.
    Any one who over pays and asks for cash back, not good
     
  20. 5spd

    5spd TS Member

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2008
    Messages:
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    100% SCAM. Dont cash check its fake and you will be help responsible for all monies attached to it.
    Keep the check, stick it on the wall for a reminder of what you almost fell for.
     
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