1. Attention: We have put together a thread with tips and a tutorial video to help with using the new software. Please take a moment to check out the thread here: Trapshooters.com Tutorial & Help Video.
    Dismiss Notice

What is wrong with early K-32 receivers?

Discussion in 'Uncategorized Threads' started by DTrykow, Jan 28, 2008.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. DTrykow

    DTrykow Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    1,541
    bubbaw: Some minor differences with the springs and the trigger shoe not being adjustable, some of which you've updated. But the big difference in the older/early Model 32, which was renamed the K32 to get the people to stop thinking it was a Rem 32, is the receiver and Forend Iron are NOT case hardened. The new ones are. Even though I've never seen a older K32 worn out due to soft metal, I'm told it makes a difference to people who know about it and they stay away from them. I've put my Old Model 32 side by side with my friends K-80, with the stocks off, and their virtually identical. Hope this helps. Dave T.
     
  2. fearlessfain

    fearlessfain TS Member

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2006
    Messages:
    520
    i don't know about the new ones but the gunsmiths used to tighten up the barrel fit by squeezing the receiver in a vice--no kidding, i have seen it done.
     
  3. ljutic231

    ljutic231 TS Member

    Joined:
    May 18, 2007
    Messages:
    521
    The older one;s were basically handmade and the receiver top tang is slightly different than the K-80 and the bottom trigger guard is rounded on the back end and if you use a K-80 stock you will have to alter it somewhat.
    I have had 2 of the older one;s and nothing ever happened to them. But that was before the yearly maintaince was necessay.
    Bob
     
  4. BDodd

    BDodd TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    3,594
    Straight from the mouth of a retired Krieghoff smith from Germany, "There's nothing wrong with the M. 32 Krieghoff. No reason to convert it with K-80 parts or reject it over a K-80.".....breakemall.....Bob Dodd
     
  5. g7777777

    g7777777 TS Supporters TS Supporters

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    9,353
    The originial question is what is different with early K32 actions as compared to later and implied- why isnt my K32 updated worth more

    In reverse order

    1st -- what exactly is updated on your K32? probably 80 percent or more of K32s over the years have had some version of K80 hammers and sears installed so that is kind of expected- no premium paid-- you are probably asking some premium for something that isnt worth much if anything

    2nd---in the first 1000 or so actions- about 500 of them were different and they werent the first 500 for various reasons- but basically the geometry inside the action itself was slightly different and how the trigger was affixed and works is different- and not only was the geometry different but the tolerances were different also

    K32s just like K80s after them- kept having small improvements made in the parts-- those first 1000 had more difficulty in the updating because of their differences - until lately- and now if you are willing to have rewelding and remachining done at Ottsville- most of the improvements if not all can be incorporated into any of the K32 actions (of course it will cost more

    regards from Iowa

    Gene
     
  6. AveragEd

    AveragEd Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    5,474
    Location:
    Mechanicsburg, Pennsylvania
    Well now, Al, there were some differences between the earliest Model 32s (they are not and never were referred to by Krieghoff as K-32s) and their successors. As Bob said, those differences aren't terribly important, but they do exist. The very first Model 32s contained more hand-machining and hand-fitting as well as some actual Remington Model 32 parts. Most Model 32s were "all" Krieghoff but those earliest guns were exceptions.

    While upfitting Model 32s with K-80 internals is a great investment in your Model 32, only release trigger guns benefit from the change enough to make it worthwhile. Second design and newer K-80 hammers have the release lugs forged into the hammers instead of the hammers having to be drilled for the insertion of a pin, which often resulted in broken hammers down the road. But such work is expensive - when I had a Model 32 combo converted in 1995, the K-80 trigger group alone cost $750 plus the labor to fit it.

    As far as Model 32 receivers not being "hard", they are not case-hardened like K-80 receivers but they certainly are not "soft" and are no softer than most Browning or Berettas.

    Ed
     
  7. todman2

    todman2 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2007
    Messages:
    286
    Location:
    Fort Myers, Florida
    The Early Krieghoffs (Late 50's and early 60's)are called TRANSITION GUNS the internal mechanism was very different than the later model 32 and was practically identical to the Remington Model 32. During the early 60's Krieghoff completely redesigned the internals. Just about everything was changed except the top latch and opening lever. Sears were not only different but worked in a different way. The trigger was completely redesigned.

    If you follow this link, http://www.krieghoff.co.uk/271.html

    It will take you straight to two pictures of early Model 32 guns, one with the Remington action and one with the later Krieghoff design. A testament to the good design work done all those years ago is that it is essentially the same as the K-80 today although the K-80 has been considerably refined and honed over the past 25 years.

    I have 2 transition guns #3XX and #78X with the K32 Trigger upgrades and with the stocks on you can't tell them from any other K32. They always perform well and I look at them as a bargain since everyone else thinks they are a lesser gun. A Krieghoff is a Krieghoff even if its an old one.
     
  8. BDodd

    BDodd TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    3,594
    And, I have #919, according to Dupont it was shipped to the US in '61, and it has the K internals; all original....breakemall....Bob Dodd
     
  9. Shooting Coach

    Shooting Coach Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2006
    Messages:
    8,351
    Location:
    Nashville Tn
    According to Norbert Haussman, formerly of Kreighoff Intl', the ONLY gun in the world better than the M-32 Krieghoff is the K-80.

    When I sent in a late model low mileage M-32 to be updated to K-80 internals, Norbert called me at home and talked me out of it. He said there was NOTHING wrong with the M-32 design, and to leave it alone. The factory M-32 trigger is a NATURAL WINTER TRIGGER, better in cold weather with gloves than the K-80. Many K-80's used in the field have had the M-32 trigger retrofitted.

    Typical service from Krieghoff. I hope Norbert is doing well in Texas.

    As far as the "parrot". Gene is likely right. As the original M-32 parts are worn in old high volume guns, parts replaced are of current manufacture.
     
  10. skeet_man

    skeet_man Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    10,510
    Location:
    Rochester, NY
    with all that being said, since your gun has already been fully updated to all k80 parts, it should be no different in value or function than any other model 32 that has been updated
     
  11. johnpe

    johnpe Member

    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2006
    Messages:
    293
    I don't have a K-32 or a K-80 to use for comparison, but I do have four of the Remington 32's in various configurations. I also have a separate set of skeet barrels. When I purchased the skeet barrels it didn't have any extractors. K-32 extractors were installed and have worked perfectly for the last 45 or so years on two different actions. I know another Rem. M32 with a K-32 sliding locking cover. It also fit perfectly. All of the barrels of my guns will swap between actions as long as the forearm for that barrel is used. Several years ago, one of the guys at the club bought a new K-80 trap gun. With his permission, I took his barrels and forearm and put it on to one of my Rem. 32's and shot a round with it. Obviously, the differences between Remingtons and Krieghoffs are small in several areas. The big difference seems to be the trigger. The Kreighoff trigger is very different from the Remington. This may not have been true for the very early K-32's. Several years ago I saw a three digit SN K-32 and if memory serves me, the trigger looked the same as the Rem. M32.
     
  12. CharlesR1100

    CharlesR1100 TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    436
    Not case hardened. Per Krieghoff. They ought to know.
     
  13. g7777777

    g7777777 TS Supporters TS Supporters

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    9,353
    1. Case hardened is not a significan distinction except for surface scratching-- which was why it was done-- it doesnt make the K80 recceiver more safe

    2. Remington 32s actually came with two different size hinge pins- referred to small or large- the large ones are comparable to the Krieghoffs-- I have a highly engraved Remington 32 that I have had K80 barrels fit to and likewise- I have had Remington barrels fit to my K80 - but it is not as simple as it sounds

    3. I have actually had a couple of lightweight K80 receivers with K32 triggers-I own one now- I use it to hunt with-- krieghoff used to do about 10-12 like that a year

    4. There is nothing wrong as Ed stated with K32 triggers, and remember there is the trigger blade, hammers and sears and barrel selector that we commonly associate with what we call a trigger- and trigger covers several parts but if you take a look at the blade part- it was specially designed for even engagement and let off- note that it looks like an international rifle trigger-that design wasnt by accident but it isnt what americans were used to look wise- also the K32 trigger blade has more room in for insertion of a gloved finger-- the blade part is the most expensive of those parts and as I stated- most K32s have long ago had K80 at least first generation hammers or sears fitted



    regards from the great state of Iowa

    Gene

    EDITED BY MODERATOR
     
  14. DTrykow

    DTrykow Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    1,541
    bubbaw: Now that we've ironed out the differences or lack there of, What's your price? And post a picture. Dave T.
     
  15. todman2

    todman2 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2007
    Messages:
    286
    Location:
    Fort Myers, Florida
    One last thread for consideration. Is there really anything wrong with an early K32 that has been shot for over 40 years and is still being shot in competion today ?? It only shows that an investment in a Kreighoff is a sound decision and while it is human nature for us shooters to have the newest upgrades Krieghoff make, I still see alot of old K32's tearing up the skeet and Trap fields everyday. My Krieghoffs have been one of the few products that exceeded my expectation for dependability.

    My Super Crown was built in 1970 and it is my main target gun, only modification is a 30" K80 barrel with briley tubes to replace the 4 barrels and regular annual service. I re-blued this year and now it looks like new and continues to perform flawlessly. At the range there are alot of K80 owners who would give me their K80's on the spot for my K32 Super Crown. The gun being 38 years old doesn't even slow down the offers to buy or trade. Is and old standard K32 built to a lesser quailty than a K32 Super Crown ?? The last time Krieghoff serviced the gun all the parts look the same as ones on my Transition Guns.

    The last shoot I attended the winner wasn't labled as a transition gun shooter or a k32 or k80 shooter. They just called him champ.

    Shoot whatever you shoot best the rest is window dressing.
     
  16. claybrdr

    claybrdr Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    3,262
    We're talking the difference between $9,000 and $3,800 here, Sam. Maybe a Piotti would be even better, huh? Perhaps a Purdy as well....

    A better question is: would someone shoot higher scores with a K80 than a K32 that has been fully updated with K80 internals and has K80 wood? Maybe the targets can discern the engraving pattern on the receiver.
     
  17. jbshep

    jbshep Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    316
    Hal DuPont will not accept a three digit s/n K32 in trade or even buy it at any price. I've been there. That is enough difference for me!
     
  18. claybrdr

    claybrdr Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    3,262
    Well, that cinches it. If Hal won't take it in trade it must be worthless! Of course, Hal has sold a load of them over the years.
     
  19. BDodd

    BDodd TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    3,594
    He (Dupont) originally marketed ALL of the 3 digit M.32s in this country. This provides another reason to deal with other sources....Bob Dodd
     
  20. todman2

    todman2 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2007
    Messages:
    286
    Location:
    Fort Myers, Florida
    Maybe part of the reason Hal won't take them on trade is the conception by shooters that they are inferior which makes them a little harder to sell.

    Funny that he won't take them on trade since he will sure work on them without a second thought. I know Hal personally and while I have not talked to him for several years he is a businessman and like most businessmen he seeks the maximium profit for the least cost. The last time I looked newer K80's were selling with a potentially larger profit margin then the older K32's.

    Bob is right, the company (Europa now duPont Krieghoff) started it all and Hal was the only person for years that a factory Krieghoff could be purchased from in the United States. Hal's control on Krieghoff sales in the USA as I understand, was ending when the K80's were developed which was around the time Hal's exclusive sales rights to the USA were expiring.

    According to duPont Krieghoff's web site it looks like they have more used K80's for sale than K32's. Maybe it because the K32 shooters know their guns are still good for a few hundred thousand rounds more and don't need to part with them. When the price is right a Krieghoff, new or old will always sell. If you don't like Hal's terms find another dealer. Never had a problem buying, selling or trading a K32 or K80 regardless of its serial number.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
Search tags for this page

how to tighten up krieghoff k32