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Way Off Topic- New Furnace

Discussion in 'Off Topic Threads' started by tcouch, Dec 14, 2012.

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  1. tcouch

    tcouch Member

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    Hi all,

    We are looking at getting a new furnace. Our current furnace is 20 years old and seems to have small issues every other month or so. We have decided to replace it and I’m hoping that we have a couple HVAC guys here to give their opinions.

    I have quotes from Trane, TempStar and Bryant, three different contractors. They all gave quotes for 95% and 96% efficiency units with 14.5 and 16 Seer A/C units.

    My house is about 950sq feet with good insulation and new windows.

    The tempstar unit has been the most affordable so far, 96%, 16 Seer is $4250 after all rebates. All other are 2k more.

    Does anyone have any opinions on the tempstar brand? I know it’s made by ICP who makes several other brands. So far my internet research has found that it is a good brand, but more importantly all units are directly affected by the install. A bad install seems like it will cripple even the best brand.

    We are located in central Illinois if that matters.

    Thank you all for your opinions.

    Tim
     
  2. halfmile

    halfmile Well-Known Member

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    You should get opinions from mmore than one installer or a contractor, I have been told that I would be better off with a slightly lower efficiency because of heat exchanges not lasting as long with the high efficiency models.

    I can afford a couple extra bucks a month if it means longer service life.

    HM
     
  3. Stl Flyn

    Stl Flyn Well-Known Member

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    I believe TS name, Catpower is in HVAC. He will probably respond soon.

    If not PM him. He is usually creating HAVOC, in the political section. LOL. Just kidding.
     
  4. Shawn

    Shawn Member

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    If you are a Costco member I would get a quote from them as well.
     
  5. ScottEslick

    ScottEslick Member

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    Yes, the install and the warranty that you get is the most important thing. do your research on the company/contractor not the brand. We are all concerned about price but cheap is not always good. I can show you some pictures of cheap and you decide if that is what you want.

    You can PM me if you want to talk about it

    Scott
     
  6. Catpower

    Catpower Molon Labe TS Supporters

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    Yeah Jon I love to create HAVOC with you, you are too much fun not to LOL

    Scott put up some good info, as far as the brand I would say Bryant because it is a Carrier product, but that's what we sell

    Stay with a good reputable company that is doing the installation, one that has been in the bidness for a while, that is one of the most important things, then the manufacturer, if the unit is installed properly all the big names are about on an even keel

    I know the giverment and manufactures will want to shoot me for this, but the super high efficiency stuff will seldom return all the investment costs, it will save money but going from a 14 SEER to 16, the unit would have to have a good long life to recoup the initial cost
     
  7. Auctioneer

    Auctioneer Well-Known Member

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    Pick a brand or brands and then get three or four estiments(sp) each. If you get three estiments and all three are diff units you are getting no where. You need to pick the brand and go from there. I also tell the person that he is the last of three or four people. That way he knows your talking to other people and he will be careful of his pricing.

    I just had one put in my cottage but I was VERY VERY LUCKY to have a tenent to works on heating and air. He got me the unit at cost. $600.00 and put it in. I have also helped him on somethings so it was scratch my back and I will scratch yours. Besides he likes it here on the place then a city apartment.
     
  8. GW22

    GW22 Active Member

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    "The tempstar unit... is $4250 after all rebates. All other are 2k more."

    Tim: Shop around. Unless the ductwork needs to be replaced or you've got an asbestos abatement problem there's No Way On God's Green Earth that you should pay $6250 for the furnace and A/C in a 950 Sq. Ft. house. That's utterly ridiculous.

    Regarding paying for higher efficiency, high efficiency furnaces can pay off, but above 14 SEER the higher price will never be recovered where you live.

    -Gary
     
  9. tcouch

    tcouch Member

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    The duct work doesn't need any work, we changed that when we did an addition 3 years ago. Didn't add on enough to change HVAC requirements.

    I agree $6250 is way too much. We are getting around $900 in rebates from the utility company, which is included in the prices. If we go with a lower efficiency unit we lose $500 in rebates.

    I'm going to find other temp star and Bryant dealers in the area and have them quote it.

    Does anyone know about how much they should charge for labor? No duck work changes, unit is in an open area. It has new gas lines and electrical.it will go from double wall pipe to PVC. It is 12 feet to the outside wall, open ceiling.


    Again thank you,

    Tim
     
  10. quartering

    quartering Active Member

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    my parents just had to get a new heat pump. i don't recall the cost or the brand, but it didn't cost them anything up front: tva rolls the cost into a monthly payment plan sent with the power bill. tva estimates that the new power bill with the new equipment payment will still be less each month than their previous power bills using the old system. you might want to see what your power company has to offer. good luck with it
     
  11. orange crusher

    orange crusher Member

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    I spent over 2-hours with the HVAC folks this morning - thing was blowing cold air all night. I do not recommend Trane - cost is huge and satisfaction is very low!

    We put a large Trane Unit in our home about 4 years ago (at our HVAC company recommendation) - thing is a lemon! We had never had HVAC issues and this unit averages 2-breakdowns per year along with doing routine maintenance twice per year. I looked this model and others of Trane manufacture up on the internet and user reviews are overwhelming extremely poor in customer ratings. These are high cost units and to work this poorly is a scam.

    OC
     
  12. Barrelbulge(Fl)

    Barrelbulge(Fl) TS Supporters TS Supporters

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    Not that it matters but 2 years ago I decided to replace my furnace since it was in the house when we bought it 26 years ago. All that time we did not have A/C. Since I was in construstion and part of my job was buying outside materials, I got 4 bids. The last one I got was from Home Depot. They sub their work out to a firm that has been around for quite a while. Low and behold they were the lowest price. Close but lowest. I got a new 97% effiecient furnace and A/c that I never had for $4500. Sq. ft. of house living space 1750. I beleive it was a Trane unit. If for no other reason than to keep everyone honest get a quote from Home Depot. When I purchased the Govt. was giving a $500 tax credit. Bulge.

    My mistake. I was not positive of the make so I went down to the basement to check. It's a Rheem.
     
  13. Catpower

    Catpower Molon Labe TS Supporters

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    Just to add a little fuel to the fire, you would need about 2 tons to cool you house with, a complete 2 ton 16 seer Payne system costs me about $2,057 in Texas

    It it's in a basement it would take at the most 8 hrs for two installers to complete if they took their sweet time, so figure $100 per hour for the lead guy and $50 for the assistant (we can't call them helpers anymore, it hurts their little feelings)so you have $1,200 in labor, plus other sheet metal flue etc

    A Carrier or Bryant will cost more, I don't have their price list on this 'puter, but it is only a $100-200

    Unfortunately there are a lot of companies out there boning the customer, I believe in making a profit, but ripping somebody off just because you competition is is just wrong
     
  14. wayneo

    wayneo Active Member

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    If you have new ducts, gas, and electrical, why not have the one you have completely cleaned and rebuilt? Heat exchanger, A-coil, fan, motor, belt, circuit board, burner, and a couple of sensors. Thats about it.

    Wayne
     
  15. Catpower

    Catpower Molon Labe TS Supporters

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    Wayne the manufacturers have figured that out the parts are now so high priced it's cheaper to replace it

    On my personal unit in the house it has an ECM or electrically commutated motor, last summer it quit it had a bad module the module for it was $300 my wholesale cost, the whole motor was $1200 my cost

    I found a company that sells the thermistor that is generally the only thing that goes out on them for $10

    But circuit boards have also gone through the roof

    But the down side is even the best stuff made today is junk all in the name of efficiency, at least that's what they say as they use copper so thin to make the coils you can read the news paper though it, just so it cover warranty they want it to crash
     
  16. YOTESLAYER

    YOTESLAYER Member

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    I recommend an air to air heat pump. I was spending $300-350 per month for LP gas. I put in the heat pump and my electric bill went up $100/month and used only $150 in LP last winter. Granted last winter was mild compared to the winter before. Well worth it in my opinion.
     
  17. tcouch

    tcouch Member

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    Catpower- do you think I should stay away from the ECM?

    Do you guys think $4250 is out of line for all of this?

    What do you think about a built in humidifier?

    Thank you again,

    Tim
     
  18. Catpower

    Catpower Molon Labe TS Supporters

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    Most of the ECM's they are using now are a lot cheaper, but I still think they are kind of a joke, yes they save power but the return will probably never pay for itself

    $4250 isn't really out of line for what they sell for now, it just seems a little high to me, but most of the work my company does is heavy commercial/ industrial

    Yes a heat pump is good two years ago I built a geo unit for our house, my cost for a commercially built unit the same size was $12,000 I built mine for just a little over $1200 but we have a lake in our back yard that I use for a "pump and dump" it has saved us a bunch of money and the good part about a geo unit is when it gets cold outside it still puts out 72,000 btu an air to air the heat output diminished when it gets cold outside
     
  19. ScottEslick

    ScottEslick Member

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    Tim,

    The ECM motor will also help move the air around your house, I don't know your duct layout but it sometimes help temperature unevenness

    That is a very good price, for what you are getting, I know what is being charged by reputable companies around the DC area

    A humidifier is a very good idea as long as it is maintained

    Hope this helps

    Scott
     
  20. jimsw

    jimsw Member

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    I don't know how to size your furnace. But as far as efficiency is concerned I'm having a lot of luck with a new furnace in Vermont. For many reasons I am stuck with propane for fuel which is so expensive it is nuts. At the recommendation of a trapshooter friend and heating contractor I put in an Energy Kinetics System 2000. A local Vermont contractor did the installation and agreed that was an excellent system for my situation. This summer it ran to heat water only and I burned 14 gallons of propane. Last year with exactly the same number of days of usage I burned 65 gallons.

    The system isn't cheap but I have a major problem in a very cold climate and really no fuel choices available. At one point I considered switching to oil which would have been cheaper but there were too many problems to overcome.
     
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