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Wad problem creases in reloads

Discussion in 'Uncategorized Threads' started by striper, Nov 11, 2008.

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  1. striper

    striper Member

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    Down Range XL-1 This burgundy wad has been changed to NEON GREEN. It is produced for primary use in the Remington STS & Winchester hullls with 1 ounce loads. I am having problems using this wad in the Grey AA. Why are these wads causing a crease in the shell case.It will also do it with the red AA. I am loading one oz 16.5 gr of titewad,209 primer. Any one else have this problem and whats the solution. .The bulge appears in just some of the shells. Use mec 9000 loader. TY
     
  2. phirel

    phirel TS Member

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    striper- The solution is simple. Make sure your wad is seated with about 5 pounds of pressure (more won't hurt or help). Raise your crimp starter and final crimper about 1 turn.

    Pat Ireland
     
  3. maclellan1911

    maclellan1911 TS Member

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    see if the crimp is not caused by the wad catching the secoundary cup at the bottom of the hull.
     
  4. esoxhunter

    esoxhunter Well-Known Member

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    striper: I had the same problem with the grey AA and the red AA hulls. After many attempts to rectify this problem I gave all of these hulls to my son and devoted my time to loading nothing but Remington hulls. (STS and Gun Clubs). Problem solved with no further adjustments. He then proceeded to have the same problem. (Both of us load on Hornady 366 loaders). He then discarded all the hulls and switched to Remington hulls. Problems solved without any further adjustments. I use Downrange XL-1 wads and he uses Remington TGT 12 wads. It is just my opinion, but I feel that "Life is too short to load AA hulls". Ed
     
  5. Bob_K

    Bob_K Well-Known Member

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    The following used to be in the Winchester powder catalogs:

    Reloading the New AA® High Strength Hull

    Winchester has designed the new 12-guage AA high strength hull to reload with the same reloading data as the old AA hull. However, on some reloading machines, even though the components and reloading data are the same, there may need to be a minor adjustment made to the reloading machine to optimaze load fit and appearance.

    Some adjustments that can be made:

    Shooters need to lower the starter crimp or pie crimp (Fig 1). Proper adjustment should eliminate the slight buckle some shooter see if this adjustment is not made.

    The shell in Fig 2 shows an example of the crimp after adjusting the starter crimp stage. Shooters should not be able to put a pencil eraser down into the shell after the proper adjustment.

    Another adjustment that can be made is to the wad ram (Fig 3). Most reloading machines are setup for 25 to 30 lbs. of pressure. An increase of wad pressure (up to 45 lbs.) will help seat the wad, and will help the final crimping on the shell.

    On some reloading machines with a tapered crimp die, be sure that the final crimping stage on the reloading machine is clean and has no residue build up.

    Please contact your reloading machine manufacturer if you need additional assistance making the proper adjustments to your reloader.

    Shooter have found that after making a slight adjustment to the reloading machines good quality crimps and long reloading life are consistenly obtained with the new AA high strength hull. The old style AA hull can also be reloaded with the new adjustments.
     
  6. stokinpls

    stokinpls Well-Known Member

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    They left out the part about the detachable basewad.
     
  7. JohnR

    JohnR Active Member

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    I also have trouble with the XL1 in the new HS AA. I love that wad in the Remington hulls but have found the Downrange DRA-12 pink wad is a better choice for 1oz loads in the HS AA.

    The AAHS has less internal volume than the old AA and the DRA-12 is designed for it. I use 17.5 Promo,Wolf 209,and the XL1 wad for Remington,Dra-12 for AA. Each load smokes targets when I do my part.

    One other plus with the DRA-12 is that it has small air vents cast in the side of the base so air does not get trapped when pressing the wad in causing the wad to rise before crimping. I have had this problem with the AA HS hulls and its a pain in the ass.

    John
     
  8. phirel

    phirel TS Member

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    I tried the recommendations by Winchester and they did not work for me. I realized that my final crimp was smashing the components and causing the buckled ring around the case. I made the adjustments I posted above and everything is fine. I only reload AA hulls. Not because I believe they are best, but because I have so many of the hulls and components.

    Pat Ireland
     
  9. oleolliedawg

    oleolliedawg Banned User Banned TS Supporters

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    Never had one problem with any of my Spolars!!
     
  10. TC

    TC TS Member

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    It took me about a month to figure out what was going on with the new AA's. I ruined several hundred until I got it done. Have not had a single problem in the last 4 years.

    1. Once a hull is creased or buckled, throw it away, it never gets better.

    2. You can't get a 1 1/2 lbs. of anything into a 1 lb. container.

    3. Get an adequate amount of pre-crimp, a little more than the old AA's.

    4. Make sure the crimp die body is clean and smooth inside.

    5. Make sure the crimp die body is not coming down too far, and adjust the crimp itself, not the whole die.

    6. Make sure the taper die is clean and smooth inside and not coming down too far. You generally don't need a lot of taper anyway.
     
  11. JerryP

    JerryP Active Member

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    The type of wad used has nothing to do with the wrinkles. The wad exerts no pressure on the walls of the hull to cause the hull to collapse. It's caused by too much crimp pressure. I have no problems after backing completely off the taper crimp of my PW.
     
  12. superxjeff

    superxjeff Active Member

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    It is a new style Winchester hull issue. I just load STs and don't go through all the fallderall. Jeff
     
  13. Hap MecTweaks

    Hap MecTweaks Well-Known Member

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    I'd guess the wads base is hanging up, causing the wrinkle, on the internal lip of the AAHS hull. 16.9 grains of Titewad wouldn't come up very far in that hulls base.

    JerryP, it does if the wads base hangs up on the inner lip. Hap
     
  14. TC

    TC TS Member

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    Watch where the creasing or buckling takes place, it is always in the crimp or the taper crimp stations. If the wad was hanging up you should see it happen when the wad is seated. I haven't seen this happen, but I know I haven't seen everything yet! The base wad doesn't have much of an edge, it is pretty thin.
     
  15. oleolliedawg

    oleolliedawg Banned User Banned TS Supporters

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    If the wad was hanging up just think how many rejects the factory is experiencing every day. Funny, their QC must be outstanding as I've never seen one!!
     
  16. Hap MecTweaks

    Hap MecTweaks Well-Known Member

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    The AA wad has a tapered base on it guys. DR-XL1 doesn't. Hap
     
  17. shot410ga

    shot410ga Well-Known Member

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    Use a AA wad in a AA shell, and all your problems will go away. Likewise, use a remington wad in a remington shell, for the same results. The hassel is not worth the savings achived with clones.
     
  18. 22hornet

    22hornet Well-Known Member

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    I did the same thing Pat did, with the same results. I load a LOT of AA hulls with DR-XL-1 wads, with no worries. I like the DRA-12, too.
     
  19. psfive

    psfive Member

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    In my reload production on a MEC 650 all was good untill the final crimp stage. On selected AA HS hulls just above the basewad a crease would appear. I raised it up a little over 1/32" and all of a sudden no more crease just above the basewad. Crimps looked fine, they still broke targets. Didn't seem to cause a problem on any other hulls so I left it that way. Paul
     
  20. phirel

    phirel TS Member

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    Paul- You did the right thing. If your final crimp is smashing the shell, it makes sense to raise the crimp. I raised my crimp starter the same amount. Not sure it this is important but it seemed logical to me.

    Pat Ireland
     
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