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Utah Ban on Target Shooting - Fire Hazard?

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by lboh, Jul 3, 2012.

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  1. lboh

    lboh Member

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    hmmmmmm
     
  2. yakimaman

    yakimaman Well-Known Member

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    Picked up some surplus .303 ammo a few years back and didn't know most of it was tracer. Ended up having to put out a small grass fire. A search of shooting videos on YouTube will show just how many stupid, drunken, careless gun handlers are out there. Fire potential is certainly a factor.
     
  3. Dave S

    Dave S Active Member

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    Gov. will not call special session to ban firearms, fireworks
    Related Stories
    Gov. will not call special session to ban firearms, fireworks SALT LAKE CITY — The state forester Tuesday imposed fire restrictions, including use of certain types of ammunition, in all unincorporated private and state lands as new blazes raged across Utah.


    Citing current and forecasted weather conditions, dry land and heavy vegetation, state forester Dick Buehler determined that measures must be taken to "prevent costly and damaging" forest and rangeland fires. The order does not apply to incorporated cities and towns.


    Activities prohibited until Buehler rescinds the order are:



    Setting, building or using open fires of any kind, except campfires built in facilities provided for them in improved campgrounds, picnic areas or permanent improved places of habitation.
    Smoking, except within an enclosed vehicle or building, a developed recreation site or while stopped in an area at least 3 feet in diameter that is barren or cleared mineral soil.
    Discharging or using any kind of fireworks, tracer ammunition or other pyrotechnic devices.
    Cutting, welding or grinding metals in areas of dry vegetation.
    The use of any steel-jacketed or steel-core ammunition of any caliber.
    Use of exploding targets that are detonated when struck by a projectile such as a bullet from a firearm.


    State officials determined Monday that authority to impose restrictions rests with the state forester. Utah Gov. Gary Herbert suggested earlier he may have the ability to ban fireworks and target shooting statewide, but said after a meeting with legislative leaders and state attorneys that he didn't want to have that theory tested in court.
     
  4. cafowler

    cafowler Member

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    About 10 years ago a friend was shooting shotguns with his son near their house, out in a field. The california golden hills are really dry weeds about 2' tall. He doesn't know how but a fire started about 50' from where they were. He said by the time they threw everything in the truck, grabed a shovel out of the bed, and ran back to where it started, he said it was already 50' x 50' and spreading fast. Bad turned to worst as it grew to almost a 1,000 acres, full CalFire response with 5 tanker airial attack. It's in an area with lots of expensive homes in the hills.

    A few months later he received a bill from CalFire for over $600,000, with threats of liens on his property by the state if he failed to pay in 30-days. He turned it over to his insurance agent and never heard anything again from either the state or the insurance company.

    Moral of the story, maybe it's not such a bad thing to stay out of the woods, fields during extreme fire conditions. Not sure if every state can bill someone who the state believes starts a fire, but it could ruin you financially for a little bit of fun. It was a tense 3 months for my friend and his family, especially as word spread around town that he was responsible. He swears they were no where near where they saw flames, kind of behind them and off to one side. Could a spent shotgun shell be hot enough to start dead weeds on fire? CalFire said he was the closest so must have been responsible. No interview, no ifs, ands or buts, here's a 1/2 million + dollar bill, please pay or we'll take your house.
     
  5. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

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    Oregon has taken a different approach. Instead of heaping all the blame on target shooters, they simply ban everyone from the woods who does not have a legitimate exemption to be there. This includes hikers, hunters, loggers, etc. If the woods are SOOOOOO flammable then NO ONE should be in them.

    Utah is simply picking on a subset of the overall issue, and that is not right.
     
  6. slide action

    slide action Well-Known Member

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    Other than tracer rounds,I think it 'HIGHLY" unlikely that target shooting started any fires. I have probably busted of close to a quarter millions round in my lifetime of various types of ammo and have NEVER started a fire(nor have I seen anyone else do so)! My guess is this is just another ploy by the left to restrict firearms. Given the whack job mentality of liberals, my guess is that because someone was shooting "in the area" , that automatically they ASSUME somehow it was caused by target shooting!
     
  7. daddiooo

    daddiooo TS Supporters TS Supporters

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    Down here we have a couple of places called "gun clubs".....unless you're hunting why would you be shooting in the woods anyway???


    As for Oregon.....not too surprising. Won't be long before it's illegal to go ourdoors up there.
     
  8. slide action

    slide action Well-Known Member

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    Can't go in the woods unless your hunting??? I didn't know this wasa communist China! Can't shot ANYWHERE except a Guun Club?--The liberal socialist would LOVE that! As long as I am not on federal resricted land or tresspassing on private property I believe I am breaking no laws by being outdoors wheter it is Hunting season or not!!!!!
     
  9. FRedmon

    FRedmon Active Member

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    Last September we flew into Salt Lake and the the National Guard had set a mountain on fire during a drill.

    Stuff happens....

    FRedmon
     
  10. 527varmint

    527varmint Member

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    This is normal. Anytime in CA if there is a "red flag" warning all forest is closed to shooting and hunting. You also are not allowed to park a vehicle on any forest service roads/fire roads. They will also close many gates. No fires, not even camp stoves. This usually happens during our santa ana winds.

    My friend in the marines said while stationed in hawaii they start big brush fires and had to put them out from .223 gunfire.

    Some other friends of mine where shooting at our normal target spot int he desert.
    Just regular old .223 and .22lr. They had to call the fire department. sheriff came just said don't shoot at the hillside till fall, just shoot at the flat barren area infront of the hill.

    It is a no brainer to close the forest to shooting during high fire danger.
     
  11. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

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    Mike, perhaps YOU should know what you're talking about.

    We've had anything from travel restrictions to outright closures of state forests, parks and some portions of national forests in Oregon.

    Most of these were in the 1980s and 1990s, because of very dry conditions prevalent in those decades, but there still have been restrictions in some areas since.

    Some restrictions ban commercial activities, and some have banned recreational as well. I recall when you could drive the old scenic highway in the Columbia River Gorge, but the waterfalls were posted with signage as being off limits due to fire hazard. I recall when state forests were entirely closed in NW Oregon. And when travelling on ANY road in some eastern Oregon counties (other than a US highway) required carrying an ax, shovel, a fire extinguisher and a minimum of five gallons of water.

    I'm going to guess that you either never venture out of SW Oregon, or you are simply young enough to not have had any experience with most of the closures. Otherwise you would not try to slap down others based upon your own lack of experience.
     
  12. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

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    <i>"Down here we have a couple of places called "gun clubs".....unless you're hunting why would you be shooting in the woods anyway??? "</i>

    Why? Because there is a lack of gun clubs open to the public here. I'm not talking about trap ranges. I'm talking about handgun and rifle ranges. Most are only open to the public during hunter sight-in days. And even the private ranges often have anal-retentive Fudds running them to the point where they arbitrarily ban some firearms.

    So you're left with no choice but to sight-in and practice on public lands. Of which Oregon has 46% national forest and BLM land alone. I don't know how much more state land there is, but the total for all public land well exceeds 50%. Oregon has 98,000 square miles, so that means approximately 49,000 square miles of public land. So why NOT shoot on public land? We have a RIGHT to use it.
     
  13. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

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    <i>"Other than tracer rounds,I think it 'HIGHLY" unlikely that target shooting started any fires.</i>

    The other offender is steel core ammo, particularly when it strikes rocks. The biggest culprit for this is the 7.62x39, since much of it had a mild steel core. Even so, starting a fire is exceedingly rare. There's a far greater chance of your catalytic converter on your vehicle starting a grass fire than your bullets.
     
  14. bigdogtx

    bigdogtx Well-Known Member

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    But they allow smoking in an enclosed vehicle,,,,,just how many throw their lit cigarette out while driving,,,,,just how they going to find them????

    Maybe if they were so concerned,,,,,why didn't they do controlled burn in the previous 10+ years?????
     
  15. daddiooo

    daddiooo TS Supporters TS Supporters

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    Brian,

    Shooting on open expanses of public land with a sufficient backstop...yes. Heavily wooded areas....no.
    I know many gun clubs only cater to either shotgun or pistol & rifle and in many cases are member only.

    Slide action,

    You may want to re-read the original post. Your response would seem to indicate you didn't understand it. "UNLESS you are hunting, why would you be shooting in the woods?"
     
  16. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

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    You cannot find a suitable backstop in heavily wooded areas? Nonsense. We shoot in the woods all the time.
     
  17. daddiooo

    daddiooo TS Supporters TS Supporters

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    Whatever.....
     
  18. wolfram

    wolfram Well-Known Member

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    Not to add fuel to the fire, as it were, but black powder guns (both cartridge and muzzle loaded) do throw out sufficient burning material to ignite fires. Something to keep in mind as you prepare for this year's BP hunting season.

    I know this both from having started a few small fires with my .54 plains rifle and from watching video of BP rifles and shotguns being fired.

    Lets be careful out there.
     
  19. Cobra Khan

    Cobra Khan Member

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    I'd like to see a 'Mythbuster' episode related to the ricochet bullet starting a fire! It’s now very popular for many to blame wildfires on ‘backwoods shooters’. Granted, some ‘backwoods shooters’ are throwing their cigarettes out the window, or leaving their campfire burning, or parking/driving their trucks in tall dry grass which ignite a fire on the exhaust system – this I believe is happening to some extent. However I don’t believe that the average ‘backwoods shooter’ is any more irresponsible then any other ‘backwoods recreational user’; and as such is not any more likely to start a fire then the guy 4-wheeling or the weekend camper or the dope smoker or whom ever else may be out in the backcountry. But somehow it is the guy plinking a coke can with his lead bullet .22’s, which somehow ricochet, throw a spark and start a fire? What a bunch of BS!
     
  20. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

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    wolfram, quote: <i>"Not to add fuel to the fire, as it were, but black powder guns (both cartridge and muzzle loaded) do throw out sufficient burning material to ignite fires. Something to keep in mind as you prepare for this year's BP hunting season. "</i>

    Which is why I only use my blackpowder cartridge firearms when the grass is green or during the fall after the rains start.
     
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