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universal background checks

Discussion in 'Politics, Elections & Legislation' started by Old Cowboy, Jan 20, 2013.

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  1. Old Cowboy

    Old Cowboy Active Member

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    Now THERE'S a nice warm fuzzy sounding proposal, right? After all who could possibly be against insuring that convicted felons, lunatics and wife beaters don't buy guns by private sale to get around the requirements imposed to buy from a licenced dealer?

    OK, could somebody explain to me how such could be enforced without registration? If my gun isn't registered in some "gun data base" with the federal government and I trade it to my friend John Doe in return for $500 cash unless "John Doe" turns out to be an undercover federal agent engaged in a sting operation who's gonna' prove the transaction ever occured?

    ....and while I'm on the subject, where do they come up with this 40% figure? As in "40% of gun sales don't go thru' a background check"?? What'd they, just pick that figure out'a thin air? If private sales between individuals happen without paperwork how does anybody KNOW how many such sales occur, beyond just speculation?
     
  2. scooterbum

    scooterbum Active Member

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    Just say NO!
     
  3. Catpower

    Catpower Molon Labe TS Supporters

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    It's just a liberal song and dance so they can say they are doing something, while in total honesty they have done nothing except put more onus on legal gun owners
     
  4. trapperwads

    trapperwads Well-Known Member

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    Newspaper reported several years ago that hundreds of people passed away with no accounting for handguns registered to them in Syracuse NY. Multiply this by hundred of US cities. Where are these guns?. Family members? Black market? Criminals? Drug gangs? You tell me how todays feel good legislation will find them before the criminals can have a field day with unarmed citizens. ed nichols
     
  5. Traders

    Traders Well-Known Member

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    old cowboy,

    You asked "OK, could somebody explain to me how such could be enforced without registration?" You may not like the answer.

    If there were a federal requirement that there be background check for all gun transactions, under current policies, private individuals wanting to sell guns would have to do it through a federally licensed dealer. To enforce that, the feds would ask anybody found with a gun, certainly as a byproduct of having committed a crime, "Where did you get it". If the answer is you, you might be charged with breaking federal law with all it's ramifications. You might even be considered an accomplice to the crime.

    Certainly, if you bought the gun through a dealer, there would be a record and you would have to explain what you did with the gun. Maybe it was stolen? Keep it mind, even under current law, lying to a police officer is serious stuff.

    The system wouldn't be perfect, for example if the buyer was not available to be questioned, but the threat to the legitimate sellers would be substantial. I sure wouldn't push it.

    By the way, FFL's would love such a law, although they will never admit it. It might be similar to the law written after the Kennedy assassination. No mail order guns. Have to use a FFL. My guess is that you can mail a gun and get away with it most of the time, but for sensible people, it's not worth the risk.

    And, please don't attack the messenger. I'm just giving one of many possible answers to your question.
     
  6. oleolliedawg

    oleolliedawg Banned User Banned TS Supporters

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    Transferring all sales through an FFL dealer would make me very rich as I have an FFL. I suppose I don't want to be rich as I consider it another infringement on the peoples rights by our all-caring big daddy government!!
     
  7. likes-to-shoot

    likes-to-shoot Well-Known Member

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    Our local Sheriff is the chief hunter safety instructor in our county and during one class he was ask about gun sales between citizens that doesn't require a FFL. His advice was to require a CCL or a purchase permit, write down all the information and stick it in a safe place. You in effect have a reliable sales record of who you sold the gun to.
     
  8. timberfaller

    timberfaller Well-Known Member

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    Some people don't realize that the 4473 stays with the FFL holder until he or she goes out of business or give up their FFL.

    Those records are filed away and the only time the ATF see's them is when they come in to the place of business and wants to see them or they are sent to Atlanta when FFL holder sends them there(out of business)

    As a private citizen, it is a good idea to record who you sell to or buy from. Its just common sense.

    Again its ALL about CONTROL.
     
  9. Auctioneer

    Auctioneer Well-Known Member

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    If there is an UNIVERSAL BACKGROUND CHECK that means I can buy a gun in any state and return home. At this time I can't do so unless I have a FFL lic person to send it to.
     
  10. Harley Lekvold

    Harley Lekvold TS Supporters TS Supporters

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    "Some people don't realize that the 4473 stays with the FFL holder until he or she goes out of business or give up their FFL."

    The 4473 could be destroyed after 20 years, but not the hardbound book. At least that was the law a few years ago.
     
  11. Auctioneer

    Auctioneer Well-Known Member

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    Back in the 80's a Ca gun store was suppose to turn in his books to the state so they could get all the AK's and AR's that he sold to people. Well the night before he was suppose to turn in his books the store caught fire. The fire started in the file room. The whole store was a total lose. He rebuilt the store and had some very loyal customers there after. I wonder why he did. LOL.
     
  12. halfmile

    halfmile Well-Known Member

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    I was under the impression that 4473's went to the ATF if business was discontinued.

    Only free people can own weapons.

    HM
     
  13. Harley Lekvold

    Harley Lekvold TS Supporters TS Supporters

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    4473's less then 20 years old and the hardbound book do go to the ATF when an FFL holder quits. I don't own any "weapons" but I do own a few "firearms"
     
  14. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

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    This is a backdoor scheme for de facto registration, in order to compile a list for confiscation. The wording of these various schemes bears out the registration part.
     
  15. Shooting Coach

    Shooting Coach Well-Known Member

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    As a wholesale only dealer, I would miss out on transfers, but am totally against any more gun laws. We already have over 20,000 on the books.
     
  16. cubancigar2000

    cubancigar2000 Well-Known Member

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    I gave up my FFL in 1994. At that time I asked my local ATF office who to send the records to and they did not want them
     
  17. Shooting Jack

    Shooting Jack Active Member

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    There are several facilities in several states where 4473 records are stored due to businesses no longer open. When guns are used in crimes the records are checked all the way back to place of build. Over the years I sold several guns that ended up being used in crimes. Most of them had been stolen from original owner with one exception. Wife bought a rifle knowing her husband was not allowed to have a gun due to a felony. He shot at a squirrel running on ground and bullet richocheted hitting a kid in the head. Initially, they came in the door telling me I was in serious trouble for selling a gun to a felon. After checking 4473 they found that I had done nothing wrong. No apology of course.
     
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