1. Attention: We have put together a thread with tips and a tutorial video to help with using the new software. Please take a moment to check out the thread here: Trapshooters.com Tutorial & Help Video.
    Dismiss Notice

Unions Yea or Nay?

Discussion in 'Off Topic Threads' started by Bruce Specht, Mar 7, 2010.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Bruce Specht

    Bruce Specht Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    5,326
    Location:
    Near but not in chicago
    Ok! Let's get a concensus, I belong to a union and I'm an "independent" (Republican)politicaly. Here is my reason for the post, I'm a teacher at a high school not unlike most government entities the district is in financial trouble. I and a couple of other " conservatives" have suggested that the union be open to negotiation due to the current economy. The " one for all and all for one" liberals that are the excutive board won't hear of making simple concessions to help the district reduce debt. These "Democrats" that profess to be all about helping mankind would rather see teachers let go than offer to give up a personal day or two, that would cost the union membership nothing and be helpful in reduicing debt. Keep in mind that as teachers we work 185 days a year. We get three (3) personal days a year, the district pasy our saleries and pasy for a sub for the day. This is abused weekly there are days that we have 15 or more teachers out our faculty is 125. The executive board members of the union that I've approached have responded with ," the board of education won't work with us so screw em, if there are lay offs, I have tenure so I'll be here when the dust clears". The question? what good is the union when they won't use their heads and make concessions that benfit all the members and the students they serve?
     
  2. TOOLMAKER 251

    TOOLMAKER 251 Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    3,409
    Why do teachers need unions?
     
  3. Barrelbulge(Fl)

    Barrelbulge(Fl) TS Supporters TS Supporters

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2007
    Messages:
    11,926
    Location:
    West Central Florida
    Bruce, Long ago i belonged to the steelworkers of America. I oaded furnaces with scrap. I cam inwith a hangover once and some of my union brothers told me to go in the mens roon and sit down"They couldn't come after you in there" That was not the way I was raised so i passed on the Union brothers suggestions and went back to work. Even with a hangover I outworked the normal Ubion worker that seemed to be slackers and drag their feet when doing their jobs. Probably why the mills are no longer around in part. I am not a Union enthusiast. Bulge.
     
  4. Setterman

    Setterman Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2007
    Messages:
    12,059
    no comment. this stuff brings out my bad side.
     
  5. southjblue

    southjblue Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    3,649
    They make me laugh---the teachers of today don't know how good they have it---when I grew up we had two rooms in the school house---One room had 4 rows---
    !st grade one row---2nd grade nxt row---3rd grade nxt row and so on---
    2 teachers tought 6 rows---we all made it---some are Mds--some attys some millionairs---don't mind my spelling---I am one of the 00000000---aint that great---I graduated high school and went into the service and some went to B teachers and they always tell of the days they only made $4000.00 a yr---
    I was making $1000.00 a yr and protecting their axxx---just venting ---they make me sick-----The unions ruined this country---nothing made in the USA---why --They all went over seas----gL----southjblue
     
  6. R.Kipling

    R.Kipling Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2007
    Messages:
    1,765
    Union's are just a form of organization, just like corporations. It's not the organization, it's the people that run them, and the general membership that provide the personality and character of them.

    What you're experiencing is a national problem of declining character and situational(non)ethics. If you find an answer please let me know.

    Kip
     
  7. southjblue

    southjblue Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    3,649
    Union code---More $$$---less hrs----southjblue
     
  8. crusha

    crusha TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    5,762
    This past year I made a career move from the Auto industry to aerospace/defense, and I must say I was very surprised - it's brought me into contact with a much higher class of union people. The union folks who assemble our products tend to be believers in a strong national defense (surprise, surprise), and have Rush Limbaugh blaring on their desktop radios every afternoon - if you can believe it (I don't expect you to, but it's true). They are nothing at all like the whiny-ass UAW people I had to deal with for so long. These people want no part of Obama.


    Now that's my kind of union people. I knew there had to be one or two of them out there somewhere.



    (But I have a feeling we'll be hearing from the wrong kind any minute now).
     
  9. Chugiakshooter

    Chugiakshooter Member

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2009
    Messages:
    507
    Professional Football,Basketball and Baseball players have Unions,now what.
     
  10. trapshooteraa27aa

    trapshooteraa27aa Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    2,267
    Toolmaker251 you asked why a teacher needs a union why does a toolmaker need a union? I was a plant manager for a steering company for many years. I had some responsibility on restructuring the union (aka disolving it)
    Best thing I have ever done. Have no use for unions and never will. Company now makes money with half the employess and minimal overtime. 200 employess wishing they had worked when they had a job. UAW plain and simple stands for you aint working. I do belive that some of the construction trade unions are different but still have the same problem. Hard to have a good workforce when 80% want to sit on there azz. Go ahead rip, blast, falme away. Buy non union if you can. Please send all your union dues to me I can put them to use to buy new shells for the grand.
    Chris
     
  11. Chugiakshooter

    Chugiakshooter Member

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2009
    Messages:
    507
    Airline Pilots are Union.
     
  12. K80433SC

    K80433SC Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2008
    Messages:
    411
    I have to agree with R Kipling on this one. I work in an "open" shop ; where MOST are members of the union, but it is not mandatory. I am proud to say that I do not pay union dues, and the biggest reason is the lack of work ethic that is promoted by the "leadership" (loose term) of the local branch.

    Far too many folks in this country go to work each day with the attitude that their primary objective is to "screw the man" ; to do as little as possible, while making the most money doing so. Unions instill that philosophy into their members, and then defend those who are reprimanded for lack of performance, attendance, etc.

    We also have many ridiculous overtime equity rules, which (again) benefit only those who "play the game", so as to win grievance awards at the end of every quarter for doing NOTHING. These idiots laugh all the way to the bank, but fail to realize that they are draining the very source of their own livelihoods. But again - the union tells them that THEY run the place, and these thugs / morons believe whatever the union tells them.

    What I find especially troubling is the fact that many of these clowns came from other area businesses that were run into the ground by unions. And yet - they still adhere to their primitive mindset, thinking "it won't happen here".

    Just ask the steel workers ; just ask the auto workers, etc

    I have no pity for ANY of them. They wrote their own tickets.

    There was a time when unions were necessary, to protect workers from abusive and excessive employers. However - the pendulum has swung, to the point where the excess and abuse is on the other side of the fence. I feel the price is much heavier...............
     
  13. chuckles

    chuckles Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    948
    Location:
    Michigan
    Homo Sapiens is incapable of helping and sharing with each other and therefor unions or protectors are often used to equalize the distortions....

    Consider them (Unions) a necessary evil, like government, almost always helpful and always self serving.

    regards
     
  14. andybull

    andybull Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2008
    Messages:
    1,029
    Location:
    South Carolina
    Unions are archaic. They certainly don't help businesses with their bottom lines, they empower their employees to the point that productivity goes down the tube.
     
  15. jhjanko

    jhjanko TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    44
    Back when I was a member of the IBEW, I was asked by some union reps to take the blame for another member's mistake. I had a clean work record and the other fellow was a known foul-up. He was also a shop steward. Of course, I refused. I was told if I cannot help our a union brother, there would be no help for me if I ever needed it.

    And tothink I actually had to pay dues to these extortionists. Never again.

    As to the original question, forget it. Hang on as best you can.
     
  16. likes-to-shoot

    likes-to-shoot Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2006
    Messages:
    6,508
    Location:
    Iowa
    Buzz-gun........That is exactly what I've tried to say with all my posts about unions. They are not all alike.

    Bruce....There are some teachers unions (and some others) that have initiated concessions to keep more people working but apparently that's not very newsworthy.
     
  17. Dahaub

    Dahaub Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    1,309
    Unions not good for America? What history books did you read for US history? Without unions and the fights they put up against the owners and pinkertons and the bosses we wouldn't even have a weekend. The unions are the folks that fought for and got the two day weekend. You nay sayers all show your colors about right. You don't have the guts to stand shoulder to shoulder with those you worked with for better conditions and wages let alone only working an eight hour day. Next time you only work eight for straight time and have to work two more for overtime thank a union memeber who set the standards and helped the legislatures build our laws around what's right for the working man and not what's right for the corporations. I'll bet if you guys go to a company picnic the butts of the bosses have to smeared with bag balm to keep from getting chapped from all the ass kissing you do.

    If you guys are so adament against unions go volunteer for a wage reduction and offer to work weekends for straight time so the corporation can be sure to make more money. Ever notice how the corporations that moved to Mexico and China who have reduced their labor costs by 90% still don't show good profits? Boy those guys in bookeeping are surely good at hiding money aren't they? Ever notice that? Ever notice how the uppermanagement are given outrageous bonuses and other perks when the workers unions at a plant will have to go on strike if they asked for a raise of more than 2%? You guys are good ones to be standing across from on a picket line. Your arguements are weak and so are your knees. I'm glad this country is already free cause having to go to war against oppression with the likes of most of you makes me shake my head. Dan
     
  18. Big Az Al

    Big Az Al Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2006
    Messages:
    1,438
    Location:
    near Tucson Trap
    From History,

    UNIONS began to get the workers a SAFE place to work AT a LIVING wage!

    Oddly enough the the union place of work here that is the closest, in location, and actually the same industry as I work in.

    Has had some of the worst and truly stupid accidents we have heard about! The to main reasons for those,

    First the Union bosses not only wouldn't stand up for safe working conditions! they ratted out the employees/union members that tried to report them out!

    and,

    Second workers at the Government Agency responsible for mainting safety, would call the company to verify that is this really what the company was doing? they would do it using the name of the caller! and after a fatality that had three years of documentation leading up do it, 3 from the goernment agency got fired for violating policy!

    Am I against Unions? not totally, just have seen more bad then good! The ONE union job I had, had the stupidest rules to work by that I have ever been around. Most of these seemingly designed to give some senior members really cushy/lazy do nothing jobs!

    AL
     
  19. BAD 303

    BAD 303 Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2006
    Messages:
    3,552
    Dan whatever happened to an honest days work for an honest days pay? That is right it went down the crapper when unions took over. Unions served a purpose but no longer. Much like Congress. They served for good reasons at one time but it has become a self serving format for years now and unions are no different. They simply give bad employees a place to hide. And yes i was a Teamster member for 25 years. I would not have hestitated to drop out of the union for one second. They are self serving crooks. Not people looking out for the union members best interest.Yes i will say it again Congress and people running the unions are one in the same CROOKS!!!!!!!!!
     
  20. dhip

    dhip Active Member

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2009
    Messages:
    1,466
    Location:
    westgrove,Pa.
    weii I belonged to the UAW until I retired.I believe there is a place for unions,mostliy in factories,mines,and general labor force areas.I've long said they don't belong in professional grade jobs,teachers,etc. Also don't believe they belong in government jobs,postal,etc.Always felt if you chose a profession,and got the availiable education you already had an idea what kind of atmosphere and work enviroment you were going into.Just feel if you choose a profession,then you've already determined the standards you will work under.Also when a job effects the public directly,schools,mail,etc. there no room or reason to allow strikes. While in manufacturing,such as auto,etc. the strike just hurts the business being struck againest,not the public.So the union has to be aware of what could happen if a strike goes too long.bankruptcy,etc.Oh, and don't believe all that nonsense out there about the unions are at fault for such high car prices.The real story is similiar to the banking industry,the over inflated prices are due to bonuses and high salaries,NOT hourly cost.

    Doug H.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.