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Transmission/clutch problems Malad ID..Resolved

Discussion in 'Off Topic Threads' started by omgb, Aug 9, 2010.

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  1. omgb

    omgb Well-Known Member

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    I was driving my 2002 Ford Ranger 3.0L 5 sp manual back from Bozeman Friday when i ran into a problem on the grade outside of Malad, ID. I went to down shift from 5 to 4 and the shifter would not go into gear. I pulled over as I was rapidly running out of speed on that grade. When I stopped, I tried to get 1st or 2nd with no luck. I shut off the truck, waited, called for a tow and then restarted with the truck in 1st, clutch in. As the engine caught, the truck started lurching foreword. Clearly the clutch was not fully disengaging. I was towed into Malad and after sitting for 20 min, the repair guys reported the problem was a big mystery to them. Also noteworthy was that the clutch now worked and the truck shifted perfectly. So, I paid for the tow and headed south. All was well until I got to Baker CA. Again, the clutch would not disengage and the truck would not shift. I managed to limp back onto the road and all worked well until I got past Victorville when I had some difficulty shifting from third to fourth. At a stop, with the truck in gear and the clutch depressed, I get a growling noise from the tranny. I'm thinking I have a failing slave cylinder/throwout bearing. Heat seems to make it worse as this AM, with the truck cold, everything works fine. Any Ford guys out there ever have a similar problem? BTW, Tranny oil was fine and full. Truck has 80K on the clock and has never been abused. It's a freeway truck, no local driving per-say.

    R Talley
     
  2. jburger

    jburger TS Member

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    Yeah you may be on the right track!! Check the fluid level in the slave cyl. it should take brake fluid. I've seen that style trans have problems with 5th gear and get stuck in that gear, usually its a detent problem or a shifting fork problem. Good luck hope for the best!!
     
  3. KRE

    KRE TS Member

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    Have the pilot bearing/bushing checked, if that bearing/bushing is trying to lock up from a defect as it heats up, it will lock up and pushing in the clutch will make no difference. If it is the pilot bearing/bushing sometimes you can push in the clutch and quickly hit the brakes and it will release depending on how bad it's hosed up.

    KRE
     
  4. omgb

    omgb Well-Known Member

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    Fluid levels are all OK I was thinking dirt may have gotten into the line but still, that wouldn't acount for the heat issue.
     
  5. Tron

    Tron Supporting Vendor Supporting Vendor

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    You're going to need to do a clutch job (clutch, pressure place and throw out bearing assy). If it's a 4x2, no biggy. You and a buddy could knock it out in your driveway in a few hours or so.

    If there is no hydrolic fluid leaking (brake fluid from the master and slave cylinder system), I would be extremely careful about the bleeding proceedure and not letting ANY air in what-so-ever and I'd be reluctant to even open the system (but...it is old and new fluid should probably replace the old). That reservoir holds almost no extra fluid, so air is very easily entrained into the system. They can be a real pain in the butt to bleed. Crack the bleeder once, then fill. Crack, then fill.....it's not like a brake system master cylinder in that aspect. It's not very forgiving.
     
  6. KRE

    KRE TS Member

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    Heat issue I was speaking of, is from a cold start to normal temp. As parts heat up they normally change size, Any metal burr or dirt that enters the pilot bearing/bushing can cause that item to lock onto the input shaft, there by not allowing the release of the engine from the input shaft, which is what happens when you push the clutch in, when everything is working correctly.

    KRE
     
  7. omgb

    omgb Well-Known Member

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    Well guys, we all seem to be on the same page with this one.
     
  8. Quack Shot

    Quack Shot Active Member

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    I would check with your dealer and see if there is a TSB on the issue. There have been MANY transmission/drivetrain TSBs (Technical Service Bulletins) for the Rangers and Exploders in that model year range. There was one for a noise when engaging/disengaging the clutch and some shifting issues if I remember correctly. Be sure to get the most current one, since they are superceded on a regular basis. If you'd like to find them yourself, you can go over to <a href="http://www.motorcraftservice.com/vdirs/retail/default.asp?pageid=cat_4&gutsid=productdetail" target="_blank">Motorcraft Service</a> and buy a short term subscription for around $11. You can buy a year for $99, or a month for around $22. I don't have the most current ones available anymore, but it would be a good place to start. Ford, like many other manufacturers, seem to be able to build a whole bunch of vehicles that will develop the same "issues". Once they have a handle on it, they send out a TSB or Recall. Hopefully there is something about your concern. Your Dealer can also call the tech support hotline and see if there are any ISMs on the issue. (Internal Service Messages) These are not usually published or available to outside entities, since they may have sensitive material and/or are not fully investigated and resolved.

    Here's a <a href="http://www.ford-trucks.com/tsb/tsb.php/m-FORD/y-2002/d-RANGER" target="_blank">LIST</a> of TSBs for your vehicle. Unfortunately, they don't have much more info than the titles.

    Sometimes you could get lucky and find one in a web search, but that takes a lot of time and usually ends at an offer to sell it to you for as much as Ford would get you for a full subscription. A subscription allows you to view and print whatever you find that is pertinent.

    I am always suspicious when temperature is the key in a Brake or Clutch system with hydraulics. The fluid is prone to boiling if it is contaminated or has absorbed a lot of moisture. Also, the hydraulic cylinders, actuators, etc, can distort and bypass fluid when heated. You may also have issues with distortion of the clutch disc, pressure plate, release bearing, input shaft bearing, or even a worn release bearing collar.
     
  9. BerettaJ

    BerettaJ Member

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    OMGB,

    Just had the same problem with mine (explorer, same equipment). Turned out to be the slave cylinder. Pretty common on these vehicles.

    For the labor it takes to crack into the tranny, you may as well have them replace the clutch plate and re-surface the fly wheel. I did this and it's back to normal.

    Cost was about $1100.00 Ouch!
     
  10. omgb

    omgb Well-Known Member

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    I was estimating that it would run about a grand to repair. The parts kit is about $275 for the works. Then I figured 5 hours labor min at $90 an hour plus 10% sales tax and it rolls in around a grand or $1100.00 Fortunately, the truck is paid for for over 3 years now. I just sunk about a grand into it for new tires, shocks, belts, fuel filter, alignment, brakes etc. The wife is not going to be pleased.
     
  11. Unsingle

    Unsingle Member

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    Same problem. I've had to replace three slave cylinder in 200,000 miles, always on the coldest days of winter.
     
  12. Auctioneer

    Auctioneer Well-Known Member

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    You said your wife is not going to be pleased. Now you know the cost of repair now go look at the cost of REPLACEMENT of the truck.
     
  13. omgb

    omgb Well-Known Member

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    Oh yea, I know. The sales tax alone would be more than double the cost of this repair. This is the first mechanical failure of any kind I've had with this truck and I've had it since 2002 when it was new. Shoot, I only paid 11K for it when I bought it so I can't kick at the repair cost. I wish I'd done it in Bozeman though as both the labor cost and the sales tax would be less. Since MT has no sales tax, that would have saved me a yard right then and there.
     
  14. omgb

    omgb Well-Known Member

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    Got two estimates for repair....Ford wants $965 with tax seems fair. AAMCO wants $950 with tax. I'm leaning toward Ford
     
  15. CalvinMD

    CalvinMD Well-Known Member

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    its simple to install the rebuild kits for the clutch master and slave cylinder...then refill with silicone dot5...you can do it yourself in about 3hrs and 120 bux
     
  16. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

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    I'd be suspicious of a torn or pinched seal in the slave cylinder. It is the easiest part to replace, so it's a good, logical starting point. A pinched seal can eventually relax, or the torn piece becomes unstuck, allowing normal operation for a while.

    Another thing that can cause this is a failing hose. This happens when the lining in the hose delaminates and acts as a check valve. Generally, though, this works in reverse, not allowing the clutch to return to the engaged position. If a bad hose prevents disengagement, this usually results in a high, hard clutch pedal, and that's not the case here.
     
  17. omgb

    omgb Well-Known Member

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    Clutch pedal feels normal and grab occurs about 2" off the floor, just as it always did. There was a growl the turned into a squeel for a few moments this AM when I started the truck and put it into gear. No first or reverse with the engine running. I'm pretty sure it's the slave cylindar. At 80k I'm opting for the complete overhaul. I'd hate to shell out another grand in a year or so when I finally used up the clutch plate. With luck and care, I bet I get another 8 years out of it.
     
  18. Dave P

    Dave P TS Supporters TS Supporters

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    I haven't seen an AAMCO around in years. They were some of the biggest crooks around years ago. A favorite stunt of theirs was to low ball the estimate, get your vehicle on the hoist and transmission out and all apart and then tell you "sorry, but it'll cost twice what we thought".
     
  19. trim tab

    trim tab Active Member

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    A big problem with these aftermarket outfits is when a trans goes down they fix what breaks and thats it. They do not do anly mfr. updates etc when it is out of the vehicle and what they fix could possibly be a problem and it will happen again. Seen it many many times. Plus lot of the parts are not the best compared to Mfr. oem parts. Kind of like going to auto zone, pep boys etc as lot of their parts are not the best. Juist good enbough to get by.
     
  20. omgb

    omgb Well-Known Member

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    I did go with Ford for all of the above listed reasons. FWIW, AAMCO promissed only OEM parts citing past problems with "off" brands
     
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