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This just bugs me a little.

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by jbmi, Jul 24, 2011.

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  1. jbmi

    jbmi Well-Known Member

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    Shot an ATA event today and had a situation that just bugs me a little.
    Scorer was a young lady that was really new to scoring. On the second field I clearly missed a bird (flinch, maybe 6' over :>) ) she did not call a lost bird so when we rotated she gave me a 5, I then nicely corrected her stating that #3 bird was a loss, she made the correction an apologized. I ended up with a 95
    One the third field one of the shooters ( didn't know him) on our squad also clearly missed his bird, no dust, no chips, flat out miss, you could see he knew it by his expression, again the scorer did not call it a loss and he kept the bird as part of his 98.
    Kid was new, I'm sure she was daydreaming or looking at something other than the bird, I know some of you will say the "scorer is alway right" but I'm sure you'd have argued with her if she called "loss" and you saw a chip fall .
    Trap is a game to me, you count what you break, to me it's like cheating on your golf game by forgetting exectly how many stroks you took on a hole. Is the final score that important?
     
  2. EuroJoe

    EuroJoe TS Supporters TS Supporters

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    It's ALL about score! Nothing else matters.
     
  3. HSLDS

    HSLDS Well-Known Member

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    Look at it this way.

    You were honest - tells me I would shoot with you anytime.

    Tells me also that the other guy is someone I most likely would NOT want to shoot with.

    As I often say - we need a return of character in this country (as opposed to caricature) - starting at the top.
     
  4. warpspeed

    warpspeed Member

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    Shooter in second situation should have done what you did and corrected the scorer. How sad it must be to go through life with no integrity. I'm not sure how I feel about butting in. We all jump when they call a lost bird but we see a chip fly so why not the other way ?
     
  5. Barry C. Roach

    Barry C. Roach Well-Known Member

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    It doesn't bother me a little. It bothers me a lot.

    I have seen several shooters, this year, take targets under the circumstances you just described. I look at it this way. You can never be sure what the shooter really shot when you see their score on the score sheet. It's a matter of honor and trust and they have neither.

    It's up to the shooter who shot the "questionable" target to question the scoring but a lot don't.
     
  6. grntitan

    grntitan Well-Known Member

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    I'd rather do as you did and lose the GAH then to accept a bird i clearly missed and win it all. I personally wouldn't feel like a winner.

    The word "Integrity" as used above is right. That shooter that accepted that bird he clearly missed has none.

    You are right in feeling the way you do.
     
  7. 320090T

    320090T Well-Known Member

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    With my old eyes I don't always see the chips so I don't say anything but if they ask if I hit it, I say lost. It evens out. Sucks to get old.
     
  8. cubancigar2000

    cubancigar2000 Well-Known Member

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    I am with HSLDS. We need more like you but people with integrity are disappearing. I remember when your word was your bond. I bought my first house on a handshake
     
  9. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

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    This is why at my club an experienced trap shooter calls it, and the boys or girls who are helping only write it down. They never make the actual call.
     
  10. Mountainsteve

    Mountainsteve Member

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    Shit happens. What can one say.We have all seen ref errors in pro football. Have never seen the coach have the ref reverse a call against his team. Golf is different in that the player always should know how many strokes he or she took. If he beat you by three birds whats the difference. On rare occasions, maybe twice in thousands of targets I was not scored a loss when I thought I missed. With my old eyes I just thought there must have been a black chip I did not see. Doesn't mean the guy was dishonest.
     
  11. Jacob Guthrie

    Jacob Guthrie Member

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    Integrity is easy to lose and hard to get back.
     
  12. BigM-Perazzi

    BigM-Perazzi Well-Known Member

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    I'm going to disagree a bit here. I'm generally of the opinion, the shooter is the least reliable person to see a "visible piece" due to recoil, etc. I'd put the blame on the squad mates who apparently aren't willing to voice dissent.

    Everyone seems willing to speak up when the call is 'lost' and they all see the chip. But, strangely quiet when they don't see one.

    Why do you assume your squad mates didn't agree with the scorer?

    my 2 cents worth.
     
  13. Barry C. Roach

    Barry C. Roach Well-Known Member

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    Big M Perazzi. It's the shooter should "question" the questionable target.........not call it loss.
     
  14. tarhawk

    tarhawk TS Member

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    Similar situation happened on squad I was on today. New person scoring had mistakenly marked a shooters score as a dead bird (/) but it really was lost. Scorer asked the squad when we were done what she should do... had a / with a "O" over the top of it. We told her to score it as lost..the shooter in question agreed so she did this and wrote the correct score on the sheet and the sheet was signed by the squad leader. The official score board showed one bird more for this shooter than he really got for that round. What to do now?
     
  15. quartering

    quartering Active Member

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    if that bugs you, stay away from sporting clays. good luck with it
     
  16. yakimaman

    yakimaman Well-Known Member

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    I might see a chip in the air sometimes that is more wishful thinking on my part but I'm not going to take a score that isn't correct - either up or down. I shoot at two clubs and one uses local teens for scorers (ATA) and for the most part it's ok, but from time to time I've seen these kids looking off in the distance and just daydreaming away. Bound to be wrong from time to time. The problem I had is the kid could not subtract 7 from 25 in his head - checked the sheet and told him his total was wrong - he counted the lost and had to go back and count dead ones to verify that I shot 18, not 17.
     
  17. BigM-Perazzi

    BigM-Perazzi Well-Known Member

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    I think we're mixing too many issues here. Mixed up scoring that's correctable is one thing, accepting targets is another. I'm not suggesting not 'questioning' the target. That's reasonable, and most often, a squad mate will verify the scorer.
     
  18. scooterbum

    scooterbum Active Member

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    jbmi,

    I have been seeing some green scorekeepers. And the onus is on the scorerkeepers to get it right. If this is not happening, the problem is with the chair, not the line. Many shooters cannot tell you if they chipped a bird or not, so, how do we rectify a discrepancy? I say, we need experience in the chair.
     
  19. OldGoat

    OldGoat Well-Known Member

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    This is why they put erasers on pencils...play targets only and don't sweat it. Clubs struggle to get people to work shoots...I know from experience. Many times they take anyone they can get and these things happen. Regards, Ed
     
  20. kiwiG

    kiwiG Member

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    Once upon a time I would have been full of pissanvinegar about it. I just don't see chips with my poor eyes anymore, especially when I'm shooting my flatshooting Perazzi and have to cover the target anyhow. Maybe the shooter deserves a bit of benefit of the doubt...maybe not. Don't let it spoil you day either way. Cheers-Graham.
     
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