1. Attention: We have put together a thread with tips and a tutorial video to help with using the new software. Please take a moment to check out the thread here: Trapshooters.com Tutorial & Help Video.
    Dismiss Notice

This guy is more qualified to own AWs than you...

Discussion in 'Politics, Elections & Legislation' started by crusha, May 29, 2013.

  1. crusha

    crusha TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    5,762
    ...under G777's plan to re-write the Constitution, that is. And - someday, this guy could be a potential client for Gene! That will fix him.


    A little screwy, don't you think?


    Regards from Indiana,


    buzzy
     
  2. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    25,238
    Location:
    Deplorable Bitter Clinger in Liberal La La Land
    Did he have an A4 rifle?
     
  3. Traders

    Traders Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    1,617
    Brian in Oregon puablo buzz-gun

    So what do you guys think should happen to this guy?
     
  4. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    25,238
    Location:
    Deplorable Bitter Clinger in Liberal La La Land
    What should happen? That's up to the military court to decide.

    A bigger issue is what are we going to do about forcing some soldiers to do up to four tours? Even in Korea and Vietnam there was a points system that rotated the soldiers home. This guy is a poster child for what happens when you push people to the breaking point. Had the points system been in place it's quite likely he would not have his life ruined and there would be an Afghan family still alive.
     
  5. Traders

    Traders Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    1,617
    Brian,

    Probably for the first time I have been posting on TS, you and I agree. We are asking too much of our military. Unfortunately, the points system doesn't work without a draft to provide an adequate number of new soldiers to rotate. So what do you suggest we do. Less foreign military engagement, reinstitute a draft, what?

    The original question was, "So what do you guys think should happen to this guy?" Saying the the military courts will decide shows you have a clear understand of the obvious and have successfully ducked the question. Come on. I know you have an opinion.
     
  6. noknock1

    noknock1 Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    1,399
    Location:
    Stranger in a Strange Land
    I think this poor man should that committed this horrendous act should not go to general prison but to a mental health hospital. As mentioned, our service people today have spent 3-5 years plus away from their families over the past 12+ years fighting an unconventional war, where there are no uniforms for the enemy.

    Win the hearts, win the minds... well that sucks in my opinion. I say we go in and as the famous quote goes... "kill'em all and let God sort them out.. and then get the fluck out!"

    Or, we stay the fluck out from the beginning. I am sick of us being the world's 'policeman.'

    Damn good thing for the libs that I am not President as the definition of "isolationism" would be given a footnote with what I would institute.

    Foreign aid... except to Israel... GONE, TERMINATED.

    NATO.. You want it, you pay for it, otherwise we are bringing our troops and equipment home.

    Saudi Arabia... we bring our troops and equipment home and let you defend yourselves against Iran if you don't pay us 'protection' money in the form of billions of barrels of oil... In other words, it will not cost the United States one penny to defend your sorry asses, if anything, the USA will make a few bucks being the 'tough guy' in the neighborhood.

    Japan, South Korea, etc... see above... freedom isn't free, time to pay up.

    Turkey, Pakistan, Egypt, well, your free money that we borrow from the Chinese to give to you... DONE.


    I could go on, but I think my point is clear. We are screwing our own citizens by sending them into combat zones with ridiculous rules of engagement for literally years on end to fight a losing war; and as if 'blowing up' family nucleus' because of prolonged deployments, death, disfigurements, and other major injuries aren't enough, we as a country are spending an enormous amount of BORROWED MONEY for this decade plus long endeavor... WTF?
     
  7. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    25,238
    Location:
    Deplorable Bitter Clinger in Liberal La La Land
    It's not ducking the question to not come to a conclusion based upon limited information.

    But if you really want my opinion, here it is.

    The military claims he was in control of his mental facilities when the incident went down. I find that a bit of a stretch. Normal people don't sneak out to a village at night and butcher 16 people without provocation. On the other hand, he was also abusing various substances - are people responsible for doing things while under the influence? Our courts have generally said yes. So frankly I'm on the fence. I'd have more sympathy for him if he hadn't been abusing substances. That's why I'm looking at the overall problem rather than focusing on his specific situation.

    I don't know if a draft is needed. Better pay and enlistment incentives is the key, along with putting an end to forcing people to do multiple tours. That's a big disincentive to enlist right there. People who will sign up to do two, four or six years of active service plus two or four years of reserve to total six simply are turned off when faced with the prospect of being extended beyond that.
     
  8. g7777777

    g7777777 TS Supporters TS Supporters

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    9,354
    Buzz gun should have been drafted-- at least he would have some idea of service to the nation rather than anti military and anti police post- one after another

    People like him did nothing to gain freedoms- by an accident of nature he was just born here

    Buzz gun BS about trying to enlist and they wouldn't take him- all BS just like him

    Buzz gun is apparently just a fearful little coward sucking the life blood out of America rather than contributing- just another keyboard commando





    Regards from Iowa

    Gene
     
  9. Leo

    Leo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    3,048
    It is a wonder that we do not hear about a lot more of this. Speaking from direct knowledge these men that are coming home from 2 and 3 extended tours are really stressed mentally. This is not like a 120 day combat tour and 3-1/2 years stateside. This is 12-15 months in a hotzone at a time, time after time. This is way TOO LONG!

    We are sitting back and letting congress and military leadership commit crimes against these soldiers. It is time for all the keyboard commandos to demand that the current policies are changed and put limits on combat tours. I already have, pretty much on an annual basis for several years.
     
  10. g7777777

    g7777777 TS Supporters TS Supporters

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    9,354
    The reality of the situation is that politicians once they are in office don't have a lot of options to exert "political power" around the world

    The protection of the oil supply into America has been an objective for 100 years. Fracking will ease that.

    Still, I do believe you should have to serve to get the right to vote. Freeloading isn't a good option. Other nations that are doing much better than we are have universal service requirements. Maybe after basic you could go into a civilian work corp if you somehow objected to the military but you should have to serve

    As far as my position on AR type rifles- yes I do think everyone should have to pass a qualification course to own one, just like hunters education but I think military members and police should be exempted from that requirement

    Regards from Iowa

    Gene
     
  11. ivanhoe

    ivanhoe Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    7,539
    Location:
    Oxford MA
    Lets see seven, sevens says

    "Still, I do believe you should have to serve to get the right to vote."

    Well Gene its a good thing that it hasn't been a law in this country. It has been 57+ years since world war II ended a time in history when the military had the largest enlistment of the last century the numbers of those that served were very low compared to what one would think they were.

    Percentage who actually have served their Country in the military.

    Something to think about.

    Received from a friend

    In World War II, 11.2% of the nation served in four years.

    In Vietnam , 4.3% served in 12 years.

    Since 2001, only 0.45% of our population has served in the Global War on Terror.

    Hardly seems like this country would still be free. As far as peace time military in between wars no better. Would seem that the minority would be deciding for the majority.

    Bob Lawless
     
  12. Old Cowboy

    Old Cowboy Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    2,988
    What should happen to this guy?

    He was drunk and high on drugs and went out and murdered a bunch of innocent people, he's entered a guilty plea in exchange for a guarantee of no death penalty so it appears as tho' he'll be sentenced to life in prison, the only question left seems to be parole eligibility or not? I'd say "not".

    So what if he's had muliple deployments? He's in the Army of his own free will, that's what the Army is FOR....to fight wars.

    FWIW personally I think the draft was a good thing for the country altho' I might suggest a few reforms but I doubt it'll ever return unless WWIII happens.
     
  13. Catpower

    Catpower Molon Labe TS Supporters

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    10,234
    Location:
    In the Cabana
    John if WW III starts our country in the shape it is in now would just roll over and play dead
     
  14. Old Cowboy

    Old Cowboy Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    2,988
    I suspect you're right Cat... This country has gotten a well deserved reputation around the world of picking fights and then turning tail and running home to mama when we get our nose bloodied.
     
  15. darr

    darr Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    1,994
    If it wasn't for drink and drugs I would be completely sympathetic to this guy. That being said he couldn't of been in his right mind drink, drugs or no.


    I wonder how many American Soldiers have been killed because of this slaughter. I must admit I have had little sympathy for the collateral damage this war has created. But this incident really drives it home. I wonder why this village was picked by this soldier? If he had slaughtered insurgents for revenge it would be understandable. But slaughtering sleeping women and children is beyond comprehension. I'm sure many Americans have paid for this crime. And you can't blame the people who made them pay.


    Darr
     
  16. ivanhoe

    ivanhoe Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    7,539
    Location:
    Oxford MA
    "The original question was, "So what do you guys think should happen to this guy?""

    Traders that was not the original question!!!!! That was your original question, yet you didn't start this thread.

    The original question was aimed at seven, sevens belief that everyone that owns an assault weapon should serve in the military. Or be disqualified from ownership of an AW his term not mine.

    The original question was that, that idea was "A little screwy, don't you think?"

    If you wish to discuss what should happen to this guy start your own thread!!!!!!

    Bob Lawless
     
  17. g7777777

    g7777777 TS Supporters TS Supporters

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    9,354
    Bob lawless- I never stated that only people that had ever been in the military should own assault type rifles- you are nutso- despite me giving you some credit earlier

    I stated and will state again, that people should pass a class, just as they do for hunters ed or in some states CCW before they are allowed to own assault type rilfes, but military and police should be exempt from that class requirement. Heck they had weeks of it during basic training, not to mention afterwards

    Then the military and cop haters started posting.

    Regards from Iowa

    Gene
     
  18. ivanhoe

    ivanhoe Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    7,539
    Location:
    Oxford MA
    "I never stated that only people that had ever been in the military should own assault type rifles- you are nutso"

    Well seven, sevens I never said you stated that. What I did say was the original question was aimed at your "belief" that everyone that owns an assault weapon should serve in the military.

    That is what I read as fact.

    Subject: Gun Control;Gun Owners Input

    From: GN7777777

    Email:

    Date: Sun, Dec 16, 2012 - 02:17 PM ET

    Website Address:

    Maybe you should not be allowed to own a gun or at least some types of guns unless you have completed your military service obligation successfully?

    Ever think of that?

    And you dont get the right to vote unless you have completed 8 years- 2 active and 6 oncall of "national service" which can be the peace corps- civilan work corps or the military-

    Only military service however would give you the right to bear arms or at least some types of arms

    Regards from Iowa

    Gene

    Now Gene if I am nutso tell us did you write and post that on this forum I copied and pasted it from past threads.

    So just who is the nutso here Gene???????? Your problem is you spew so much crap on here you don't know what you have posted and what you haven't posted.

    Bob Lawless
     
  19. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    25,238
    Location:
    Deplorable Bitter Clinger in Liberal La La Land
    So people should have to take a class to shoot an M1 Carbine but not a Rem 7400?
     
  20. Traders

    Traders Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    1,617
    ivanhoe

    Since the subject of the thread was Sgt Robert Bales, my question "So what do you guys think should happen to this guy?" did not seem inappropriate. Clearly since there were so many reasonable, thoughtful answers, other posters did not have a problem offering their opinions. To bad you did.

    Brian, Leo

    I agree that the bigger problem than Bales as an individual is the enormous stress on our combat troops. We could also throw in the sailors on extended at sea deployments. Not the same as combat, but very stressful.

    Brian,

    You said that as a way of relieving the pressure on our combat troops you recommended there be "better pay and enlistment incentives."

    i don't believe either one would make any difference. Currently for new inductees, military pay and benefits are better than civilians for individuals of comparable experience and skills. And, it gets significantly better as the soldier advances. If there were better pay, either Congress would have to increase the military budget, which appears to be going the other way, or the size of the standing army would have to be reduced. Better pay would increase the quality even if numbers decreased, but would then begin to be competition with the private sector. Take your choice.

    So long as Congress believes that the US needs to have a robust and visible military presence around the world and is unwilling to either increase the size of the military or start a draft, multiple, excessive tours will be necessary and will continue.

    As i said in an earlier post, either we increase the size of our military or change our foreign policy.