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The Evolution of Trapshooting - Predictions

Discussion in 'Uncategorized Threads' started by Barry C. Roach, Sep 27, 2007.

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  1. Barry C. Roach

    Barry C. Roach Well-Known Member

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    Go
     
  2. Shooting Coach

    Shooting Coach Well-Known Member

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    If prices keep going up, we may see 50 bird events at our local clubs. Some clubs have to struggle to get one squad at times.
     
  3. phirel

    phirel TS Member

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    Trapshooting has grown steadily over the last 100 years and I see no reason to doubt it will continue to grow. Of course, our growth curve has seen some shorter periods of valleys and peaks, but overall the curve has gone up.

    The greatest potential danger sign for our future growth I can see is the decline in youngsters entering the ranks of hunters. All of the shooting sports are supported by hunters.

    Pat Ireland
     
  4. smsnyder

    smsnyder Well-Known Member

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    that's why i sponsor a SCTP program. Everyone should try to sponsor one at there home club.
     
  5. Jim Porter

    Jim Porter Well-Known Member

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    Pat, thank goodness someone else has seen the REAL problem. I worked for Mossy Oak for fourteen years and had access to a lot of other sporting goods companies. I also worked for Beretta for a short time. I hammered all of them about getting involved on the ground level with the kids of shooting sports. All the companies crow about supporting kids and it is hog wash! They just don't care about the shooting sports. In the South East, we are one generation and one bad politician away from not owning a shotgun. Deer huntinhg has brought club leases where no other from of hunting is tolerated ie little boys with squirrel guns. There are no longer doves in number due to farming practices and loss of habitia. There are no quail. They wonder why license sales fall by about 3% a year. Beretta's sales are down 2.5 million in the Southeast this year. They blamwe everything but the real problem. It is not the economy, it is the need/use factor. Young fathers today REMEMBER their dads talikg about shotgun sports and wish for days gone by. They might buy a gun even thought they will not use it. When the next generation of dads who never heard their dads talk about shotgunning get in place and never speak of shotgunning--well you see the picture. I tried to make Mossy Oak realize that THEIR future depended on youth shooting because that is the only viable growth potential for the entire hunting industry. As I told Toxie Haas, who do you think will buy your product when the shooting sports are gone?
    If you doubt my words ask ANY gun or hunting related company "What are you doing at the grass routs level for thwe shooting sports"? Don't buy the we support the NSSF line. The NSSF is a watchdog program only and shooting sports are only a small part of the program. They are dammed good with what they do but can only work to a point.
    We will sit on our collective asses and lose the sport we live and many will say "THEY" took it from us and really we are gift wrping it for them.
     
  6. Hauser

    Hauser Member

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    Pat


    "Trapshooting has grown steadily over the last 100 years and I see no reason to doubt it will continue to grow"?????


    In 1973 we had 48000+ registered shooters. I dont have the latest numbers but I doubt they exceed 48000.


    Jerry Hauser
     
  7. ricks1

    ricks1 TS Member

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    problem with getting kids involved is because guns are a no no around schools they cant talk to friends about them no sports magaziens aloud and computers have replaced the weekend fun time and it dont look to improve.the two clubs i belong to the age is about 50 have not seen any teens in last 3 years rick
     
  8. FarmerD

    FarmerD TS Member

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    I only wish Pat were right, but unfortunately here in the North West it is not increasing but diminishing. Where there used to be twenty squads at an event your are lucky to have eight squads. I think the above posters are correct, lack of interest, lack of funds, and dislike of shooting sports. Richard
     
  9. J. Ashley

    J. Ashley TS Member

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    Hmm...so everything I hear/read about the tremendous growth of Sporting Clays (and its effect on gun sales/club membership) is just hype?
     
  10. phirel

    phirel TS Member

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    Jerry Hauser - I did say that our sport has grown, with valleys and peaks, for the last 100 years. You picked one valley and one peak. You point could also be made by looking at the membership in 1938 and 1944, but selecting a short segment from the 100 year growth curve is an inaccurate way to look at the curve.

    Pat Ireland
     
  11. kiwiG

    kiwiG Member

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    Hi All, Barry asked about the Evolution of trapshooting...lazer and sonic technology are probably the future, even now we have indoor simulators for shooting sports. 'Politically Correct' and 'Environmentally Friendly', not to mention economical...great for some, but if'n it don't go BANG, don't rock me back on my heels, don't smell GREAT, and don't work up a thirst, I'll probably look elsewhere for my entertainment. You are ALL correct, like it or not, as open spaces disappear, and so do outdoorsman Fathers, Uncles and Grandfathers, shooting as our generations know it WILL disappear. Collegiate shooting continues to grow, but thanks to the generosity and understanding of fewer and fewer people... how many of the kids shooting at the Grand this year will still be shooting in 10 years time, and more importantly, how many of them (with the full support of their spouse) will encourage their kids to give it a try. I've met some great people and some real a'holes shooting, but it's been an honour and priviledge. Kindest Regards-Graham.
     
  12. Hipshot 3

    Hipshot 3 TS Member

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    Two things could seriously affect the sport......A lack of more younger shooters coming into the sport and prices going out of sight.
     
  13. CharlesR1100

    CharlesR1100 TS Member

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    Guns are on borrowed time. All guns. Guns are not PC.

    There is no publicity, written or electronic, given to the shooting sports.

    TV? How exciting can it be to watch the back of some large elder guy you have never heard of with bags hung all over shoot a target? Or turn the target down.

    Not 1/10th of 1 percent of our shooting population know who the winners were at the last, or any, Grand. To the general population the winners (national or state) are totally unknown.

    How serious can anyone take trap shooting when the scorekeepers are high school kids?

    The cost of shooting precludes significant kid participation except as trap boys.

    The NRA is fighting a loosing battle. The fact that it has to fight tells the tale.

    Trap, skeet? The general population knows nothing about either, except that they use guns somehow.

    Almost every community in this country has a golf course and signs to tell us how to get there. Few have shooting facilities. And they are difficult to locate.

    No favorable publicity combined with high cost and lack of ease of access...what else is needed to close the book on trapshooting? Nothing.
     
  14. jakearoo

    jakearoo Active Member

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    Population, population, population. Too many folks, so little land. Jake
     
  15. Big Jack

    Big Jack Well-Known Member

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    Look at the young shooters of today..Obviously, they come from families that can afford to permit them to compete. The travel, guns, ammo, entries, just add it up. This elite group is not going to include the poor working man's children that can barely afford to pay for food & lodgings. I was in my mid twenties before I discovered trap shooting. I included all four of my sons as they grew into the game. Since, they have all gone the way of so many. Started their own families, bought their homes & cars. And all have drifted away from the game, I would suspect due to the lack of surplus funds could be a prime reason. My own little survey of young shooters has determined that when dad pays the bill, it's great fun. When they discover girls & cars (or trucks if that be the case) they move on to new ventures. If we are lucky, when their children grow up, they may return to the game. About twenty-five years lost in the process.

    Big Jack
     
  16. grammie

    grammie TS Member

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    So,,,,,I see many of you have finally seen the writing on the wall!!!!

    Don't look now,,,but many of you are looking down the road of time,,,and can actually see whats there,,,,,,And I might add-----you are seeing it with "clarity"!!!!

    I always asked the question,,,"how many targets will you shoot when shells are 10 per box and targets are 35/hundred",,,,,,,I am finally getting my anwser!!!!

    But alas,,,,,,those prices are not here yet,,,,but they are coming,,,and what happens when they get here????? Well,,,,you have already seen what is happening now,,,,,Wait until all the new taxes including "carbon taxes" are imposed,,,,,You boys ain't seen nothing yet!!!!!!!!

    Mr.Ireland-------On two distinct occasions,,,I personally told you the reason why the price of lead would rise,,,and on two occasions I was given the 'soft glove' treatment reserved for those that know no better!!!!

    Now sir,,,,,,again you cite the wrong reasons why trapshooting is in trouble,,,,you are in effect as another poster said,,,,"barking up the wrong tree",,,but you won't know it until its too late!!!! Hell,,its already too late!!!

    But,,,I use instances like this to soothe myself,,,and am reasured my insticts are still sharp and accurate!!!!!

    AKA Grammie........
     
  17. Hap MecTweaks

    Hap MecTweaks Well-Known Member

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    I posted this to another thread and some of it applies here also. We have to attract AND keep the working class guys that can afford trap. Why? So they will teach and inspire their youngsters to follow in their footsteps! The NSSF came up with a great idea thankfully. The last three I introduced to shooting registered trap is very telling to me.

    "What better "hard data" than simply asking prior members why they no longer shoot registered trap? Number data can be skewed to suit the intent depending on your desires and that's a proven fact.

    Some time back during one of these discussions, with permission, I posted the names of the last three shooters I introduced to registered ATA trap shooting. Those three are hunting friends of mine with great jobs and have more than enough extra income to afford registered trapshooting. All three are excellent shots too I might add and all three continue shooting to this day, not registered trap targets however. Naturally I ask my friends why those choose not to pursue the game and I wasn't totally surprised by their answers. The time and money it would take to be somewhat competitive even at the lowest classifications in ATA shooting is too great. (Read too many near perfect scores in all classes) As long as new shooters perceive our game as one of needing perfect scores even at the lowest classes, nothing will change.

    Personally I don't think any kind or sort of data would change our method of operations today. I absolutely hate cheating in any fashion in a sport that was once considered a real gentleman/ladies sport of honor. What I have the most problem with in this 2 and 3 hole debate, easy versus tougher angles, is how it came about. Club operators wanting to attract more All-Americans to their clubs for easier gained points! The sad part is almost everyone bought into this scheme of change and we see the results or hear from those no longer participating if you ask. It's no wonder more targets are being shot by less members. The telling question to ask is who started shooting more targets after the rule change and why? Was that good for the sports growth? Not in my opinion. Hap"

    Costs are here to stay, todays kids shooting isn't the total answer. Attracting the same class of shooters as our past did will help a lot. If our delegates continue on as though nothing has changed and everything is just ducky, nothing will change. Shooting less targets with more gusto may help a lot too in the cost department for those type of shooters our sport needs. Hap
     
  18. JBrooks

    JBrooks TS Member

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    Trap and all clay target sports can have a great and growing future. However, that future is dependent on marketing and opportunity.

    First, we have to define the market. It is not kids. They are not the future of this sport. They shoot until they go away to school, the military or get a job. The youth programs are a fine and worthy endeavor. Your club will go broke if you think that is all you have to do.

    Trap, if taken up as the prime recreational pursuit, is expensive. So is golf, bass fishing, water skiing, snow sports, auto racing, motorcycle riding, woodworking, etc. If you blame the cost of trap shooting for lack of growth in the sport, you are wrong.

    The drop in hunting is a result of a set of complex factors, many mentioned above. However, we need trapshooters who hunt when they are not shooting trap, not hunters who shoot trap when they are not hunting. More importantly, we need trapshooters who really don't care about hunting because they see trap as their sport and their primary recreational pursuit.

    If you want to grow the sport you have to put guns in the hands of 45+ guys (and gals), who have not shot in a long time or who have never shot at all, but have the discretionary time and income to shoot 400+ targets per month. There are millions of potential clay target shooters right now who don't even know that they can participate and enjoy the sport. They are sitting next to you at work, at church, at your service club breakfast and in the house next door. How many have you invited to your club to shoot?

    If the ATA and the other clay target sports organizations would supply club level marketing and training, the sport could grow 10%-15% per year. How? Well if just 10% -15% of your club's members brought in one new member each, that is how. This still leaves 85%-90% of your club's members to continue to sit on their fat, sorry asses and bitch about the cost of targets, shells and how things used to be better. That should be enough.

    As for the ATA, if there is growth at the club level, particularly among people who are making the sport their primary recreational pursuit, ATA membership will grow as well. However, the ATA REALLY needs to suck it up and address the classification and HC yardage systems so that new competitors have a rational system to advance and compete.

    If your club is not growing, it is YOUR fault. Further, you are wasting the heritage granted to you by the club members that have come before you ard you not fulfilling your responsibility to grow the number of shooters who will continue to support the ongoing fight to protect our Second Amendment Rights.

    So, get off your butts and get to work.
     
  19. Jeff P

    Jeff P Well-Known Member

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    Well...the sky may be falling, but Grammie is still an idiot. At least I have confidence in some things not changing....

    We're seeing new shooters at our club - not a lot, but a good percentage move off the core base we had. We only have 20 or so regular shooters, so picking up a couple - hey, that's a 10% increase.

    Kids are where its at. There just ain't any picking up the game.

    I hear that hunting is the new 'in' thing among the younger wealthy crowd. Guys that have never been out of the city are buying rifles and heading to colorado to pay somebody $10k to shoot an elk or a deer. Maybe they'll gravitate to the shooting sports.
     
  20. grammie

    grammie TS Member

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    jeffp:

    Confidence???? or Hope????

    If you think that things don't change,,,,,Then sir,,,it is indeed "you" who wears the moniker of "idiot"!!!!!!!!!

    I truly feel some sorrow for your lack of attention,,,,,for it is your kind of person that shall always be dis-appointed by the turn of events.....

    Blinded to reality by "wishfull" thinking.......

    AKA Grammie..........
     
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