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Technical advantages (buying scores)

Discussion in 'Uncategorized Threads' started by ScottD, Sep 13, 2007.

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  1. ScottD

    ScottD TS Member

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    Jan 22, 2007
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    I was talking with some friends yesterday about my new passion for shooting. After giving off an odd vibes about the guns, they switched the conversation to golf. It turns out that both of them have spent significant amounts of money buying high-tech drivers, wedges, balls and putters. Both of them INSISTED that money bought them extra yards and shaved shots off their scores.

    I can see where their claims may be valid—I think money can improve your tennis game too. It ruins the historical continuity of the sports but hey, I can see where you shouldn’t underestimate the benefits of a technical advantage in golf.

    After I gave off an odd vibe about the money=advantage in golf, they wanted to claim money matters in trap shooting too. I personally think you can’t buy a score in trap. As long as the gun fits, it can cost from 300 to 30,000 and break the targets with the same alacrity. I doubt if anyone on this forum will disagree with me about this—well some might just to be contrarian. What I would like to ask more experienced shooters her is…

    Have technical advance had a big impact on trap? Do modern shells significantly out-perform older shells? Does having a long forcing cone and a trick choke really make that big a difference? Is a new elite target shotgun like the latest $700 Nike Sasquatch uberdriver—something that gives an unfair advantage to someone with money?
     
  2. flylta

    flylta TS Member

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    I agree, "money" alone does not give an advantage, but the difference is can a single income with kids at home afford the same as retired with nice pension?

    No, but through learning and listening you can get a gun to fit and shoot a $500 or less gun as good or better than one that costs a lot more. Just takes some of us longer to get all the eggs lined up.

    Shoot as much as you can as often as you can afford...

    Ron
     
  3. Shooting Coach

    Shooting Coach Well-Known Member

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    Darn, I thought one had suggestions on "tipping" the scorer BEFORE the shoot! LOL
     
  4. pendennis

    pendennis Well-Known Member

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    ScottD - I also used to play a lot of golf, and when I had to stop playing I was at a 7 handicap (18 holes). I made it a point to keep up with technology in knowledge only. I also built my own clubs, and could build them as good as anything which came out of the factories.

    In the end, it's all about practice - perfect practice; and long hours on the practice tees and greens. Adding distance off the tee is certainly some help. It allows you to play shorter irons, loft the ball more, and cut down on the errors of long iron and wood hits. However, scoring comes from inside fifty yards. If you can't chip and putt, all the big drivers in the world won't improve your score. You have to get periodic lessons from someone besides those with whom you play. You must be willing to accept setbacks in your game when things are changed for the better. It takes time for lessons to set into your sub-conscious.

    Todays pros are better than ever. They are more fit. Compare a thirty-year old Jack Nicklaus to a thirty-year old Tiger Woods. Thirty years ago the first stop after a round was the bar. Today, its the fitness trailers and the practice tee.

    99.9% of the public can't hit the ball like a pro, because most sweep the ball instead of hitting down and pinching the ball. That's why so few could even hit a balata ball with a driver. Personally, I'd like to see all the pros play balata Titlist balls, and hit persimmon drivers. Make 'em all play steel shafts and forged irons. Then you'll see the best golfer win.

    Trap shooting and shooting sports are the same. It's not so much the equipment, as it is the shooter. The best ones have a gun which fits nearly perfectly. The fit takes another variable out of the equation. The gun shoulders and "cheeks" the same every time. The picture of the trap house is the same. The shooter points to where the bird goes, instead of where they think the bird should go.

    If a great shooter can hit 100 straight with a Kolar, then he/she could probably hit 100 straight with Remington 870; all other things being equal. The game takes place in your head, and you never let the competition take you out of your game. Tiger Woods takes a lot of competitors out of their game, but it seldom happens to him. His mental make-up just doesn't allow it to happen.

    Modern shells are also better than what was around, even in the 1960's; although some shooters still like to load their own because of element control. Most of the improvements have come along because of advances in knowledge. I'm sure the dust bins of history are filled with equipment "advances" that never worked out. New materials are here that enable fitting to happen like never before. Could you imagine a Precision Fit Stock available in 1960? Machining tolerances of then just weren't available, except at exorbitant costs. Modern computing power enables a lot of manufacturing to be done on larger scales than ever imagined. I love the look and feel of walnut, but it's probably not as stable, more machinable, and as able to hold tight tolerances as modern materials.

    I would think that no one could ever "buy" the Grand, for instance. The person who wins adapts, innovates, and overcomes (Thanks, Clint Eastwood, Heartbreak Ridge).

    Jeff Cooper once commented about someone who said the average guy never has a chance. The average guy never has a chance. Winning is about being the best, and even if the equipment were the same, the best will still win.

    Best,
    Dennis
     
  5. JBrooks

    JBrooks TS Member

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    "It is a poor workman that blames his tools."

    However, the better a craftsman is, the more advantage he can take of a good tool.

    As for Tiger, he could beat me at golf using my trap gun and me using his clubs.
     
  6. mercedesman1981

    mercedesman1981 TS Member

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    May 11, 2007
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    Flincher,

    I've read it many times here, the gun that fits you best. Could be a Remington 870 or 1100, or a P or K gun. If you like over/unders, you could pick up an inexpensive (relative to the aformentioned P - K) field gun and have a custom stock fitted to it provided you know what you need in a custom stock. If you haven't shot much, then it is hard to know what has to be done to make it fit so you "shoot where you look".

    Mike
     
  7. JBrooks

    JBrooks TS Member

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    I understand that Leo used to shoot an 1100 and in that he is the best trapshooter over the last 30 years, I think that answers your question.
     
  8. halfmile

    halfmile Well-Known Member

    Joined:
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    15,649
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    Green Bay Wisconsin
    Even a simple thing like a hammer(2.00 to 30.00) can be made better.

    If they were all the same the professional carpenters would use the cheap stuff.

    I had a new guy tell me it was the Indian, not the arrow. he was shooting a Mossberg.

    A year later he bought a GTI Browning.

    Nuff Said.

    HM
     
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