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Superx-1 Bolt Buffer sad story..... Learn from me

17K views 48 replies 23 participants last post by  Bob Hawkes 
#1 ·
Well last night I decided i wanted a trap stock for Goose hunting this morning. I had an almost new SX-1 that had seldom been shot. I took the field stock off the gun and noticed the bolt buffer looked original. I know full well that they can look perfect and shatter in one shot but I didn't want to screw with replacing it at 11:00 last night. I swapped the field stock for a montecarlo trap and put a 20 Thousanths choke in the barrel and I was ready to go. The following happened 3 shots into the morning. I had an extra gun with me so all was not lost but this cost me 250.00 becaus ethe stock is ruined.

This happened after 3 shots with a bolt buffer that looked new even though it was original. See the pictures and learn from me....





 
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#4 ·
How in the hell did the bolt follower get up that high ?? You would think it would go into the hole that the buffer was in ??

It seems the link has jumped out of the follower and went thru the buffers hole in the receiver, and into the stock, amazing.

I have shot Super X's probably more than anyone here and have never had a buffer issue, whenever it would get egg shaped I would replace it. I'm sorry for your problem, that's sad.


Tom Strunk
 
#8 ·
I agree, something other than a buffer caused this. I also have shot without a buffer (didn't know it at the time) and it marked the inside rear of the receiver but the follower stayed in the tube as it should. please keep us posted when you remove bolt. Jack
 
#11 ·
Guys... I have had lots of buffers fail over the years and quite often the link comes off of the follower. When the buffer shatters it allows the bolt to go too far back and in the process of going forward the it some how allowes the bolt to go too far forward (bolt speed I suspect) come away from the follower.

I have never seen one go down before ( down meaning in the direction of the buffer). Normally when they pop out they go up. This is quite common as I have seen it many times when an original buffer shatters.

It was a perfect timing it went down and straight through the bolt buffer hole and out the stock.

The follower is fine as this gun has only had a couple hundred rounds fired through it. Guys.. I have seen this happen before with NIB sx-1's that are 40 years old with the original buffer.

I have just never seen one( the link) come out and go down likwe this. I have seen sx-1's that were fired for years without a bolt buffer and the hole in the back and the back of the bolt were HAMMERED! The recoil return spring on a sx-1 is adjustable and I suspect some of the links popping out COULD have to do with an inproper adjustment either at the factory or from some guy messing with it.

After firing 250,000 rounds through a Sx-1 I have seen a few things and a link popping out when a bolt buffer shatters is not uncommon. I have seen it many times.

I guess the diffrence is that normally I replace the buffer as soon as I get a sx-1 but I have so many that I guess I just forgot or maybe this gun has been sitting in the safe for 10 years.

Not meaning to start a How did this happen thread as I know how it happened. I have owned a huge pile of sx-1's and this is the first time I have seen a link pop out and behave like this. I just compared the measurment of the recoil spring tube placement to my Baumgart gun and it is within a few 1/10's of an inch.

I was shooting a heavya 2 3/4 inch shell. I suspect that may not have helped things.

We did kill 20 Western Canada Geese by 7:30 though so the day was not without it's sucess.

I put a buffer in the gun and put the stock back on the gun and I suspect it will not miss a lick for the better part of 25,000 rounds.
 
#12 ·
Tom Strunk......How in the hell did the bolt follower get up that high ?? You would think it would go into the hole that the buffer was in ??

You are right Tom, It did go through the hole the buffer was in. The buffer sits right above the recoil spring assembly. Jeff
 
#13 ·
Jeff, I shoot my X-1 occasionally, I'm curious as to how the bolt can travel to far forward. Did the bolt slide link get bent a little when the buffer shattered? Is your locking bolt damaged? Unfortunate accident, those high brass shells can do funny things.

Wayne
 
#18 ·
Wow Jeff....first, I'm glad you are alright and didn't take a splinter to the face or eye.

Next, I'm glad you day of goose hunting ended well. LOL

Third, its really something that the follower went right through the buffer hole, but I'm with you, that's exactly looks like exactly what happened.

As for how a shattered (lack of) buffer caused this...I don't know either. But I can speculate that the give in the buffer slows down the return of the bolt just a bit and perhaps without it in place the returning bolt exceeded the return speed of the recoil spring and it jumped the track. Do you think you may want to look at the condition of the recoil spring also??

Sorry to see a nice trap stock go down like this, but glad you are ok.
 
#19 ·
The spring has normal tension and I will fire it this evening with heavy loads and I suspect it will be fine. If not I have piles of springs. I have a bunch of heavy springs from wrights ( BROWNELLS) that are so heavy the emptys fall at your feet. Jeff
 
#20 ·
Replaced the buffer and it shot fine with heavy and light loads. The shells ejected a normal distance so I left the spring alone.

It had to be the recoil of the third shot as the popping out of the link had to happen as it went forward. I think the kink just popped the wrong way when it did and the next shot drove it through the buffer space. My guess is that it would have went farther had it not been for the diameter of the link. Jeff
 
#21 ·
Anyone got any extra bolt buffers,stainless bolt followers,stainless magazines they'd like to sell? Sometimes I don't install the whole kit from either brownells or wrights. Jeff glad to see your alright though. I shed a tear at the loss of a stock for you. did'nt mean to highjack your thread.Jeff have you ever had the thinwall choke tubes installed on a gun barrel that has the screw in the end. I pick up another skeet grade sat. and it has the screw in it. 4 out of the 5 I own has the stupid screw in em. Never lost one but I'm due. If you prefer PM me and I wont high jack your thread. thanks Keith
 
#22 ·
Jeff, you might check to see if the recoil spring tube was screwed in deep enough into the receiver. If it wasn't to proper depth it might have allowed the connecting rod to pop out of the recoil spring follower during cycling. I have also seen damaged tubes cause drag on the recoil spring and follower, and not allow them to go all the way forward in the tube. This too, will cause the connecting rod to pop out its socket.
About 6 months ago I came across a barrel that out of headspace with the bolt because the barrel extension was not screwed to its proper place on the barrel. The barrel was the new style (without the screw in the rib) and in almost new condition. Not a problem one would expect. It was discovered by noticing that the rear end of the rib had more than an 1/8 inch gap from the front of the receiver. The gun would occasionally misfire with just a minute dimple on the primer. it would not fire Federal ammo at all. There as also about the same gap between the bolt head and the bolt body when the action was closed on the barrel. I assume it came from the factory that way.

Steve
 
#23 ·
I hear you Steve, I measured it and compared it to 4 other sx-1's including a baumgart gun and they were all within a thread or so.

This gun fired fine tonight with a variety of ammo including the same heavy ammo that I used to break the stock.

I am pretty sure of one thing... If I had replaced the buffer I knew was questionable Friday night, the worst thing that would have happened would have been the link popping out.

The stock seems like it is going to hold tension even though it has a chunk missing so at least I can use it for a hunting stock as I like the M/C stock for everything.
 
#24 ·
I too have owned many an X-1 and have fired them probably more than most people....a thread difference in recoil spring tube tension makes a difference particularly, if the return spring is weak and/or the follower binds inside the return spring tube due to the pin not being flush and/or if very heavy loads are used....

When shooting heavy loads, the link should be set a bit tighter inside the follower...for a link to jump the follower, the bolt speed was very high (hot load) and the follower did not accompany the link through its travel....perhaps the angle of the follower to the link is a bit off......

The buffer was the effect but not the cause....to each his own.....

I will never believe this accident was due to a faulty buffer. Maybe Steve Fischer could chime in.....
 
#25 ·
Well... If you are right then it will happen again.

So far it has already cycled the heaviest shells you can shoot with nothing but a new buffer.

If I was worried that it wasn't fixed, I could always bring the tube forward but I measurted two NIB sx-1's last night and one of them was exactly the same size and the other was within a thread and those guns were NIB and never fired.

I could further reduce bolt speed by putting a magnum spring in the gun or just a new standard spring. After firing the gun with magnum ammo I can see no reason to do so.

Cause? Effect?

Listen, if I had replaced the bolt buffer this would not have happened. This is why I started the thread. Not to get in a pissing match with people about why or why not this happened.

We see threads all the time to replace the bolt buffer on old /seldom fired guns even though they look new.

I posted this to show people just what the perfect storm of a brittle buffer and heavy shells can do.

I posted this too show people that it happens to people who have enough knowlage to know better but refuse to do what is recomended ( by me on these threads many times over the past 10 years) Granted this is an extreme example as any sx-1 smith will attest.

This is not the first time I have seen a link pop out of a follower. It has happened many times with diffrent guns over the years and the guns either had a bad bolt buffer Shattered or missing) or the return spring was not deep enough or both.


One thread might make a diffrence if it was toward the long side but this gun was to the short side / factory length.

As has been said a million times. Replace a factory bolt buffer if it has never been done as there are not any factory bolt buffers that are still good. Shot or not they are all brittle by now.

I was goose hunting and I thought I could get away with the 10 shots I would need to kill my 5 geese.

I could have dug deeper in the safe and got a gun that was updated, I could have replaced the buffer.

It was late and I was tired so I took a gamble and it cost me a stock.

I hope these pics help other people to undestand a possible worst case scenerio.

I can certainly see why folks might think it is something else as I suspect this is the first time any of us has seen anything this extreme.

The gun is within the tolerance of NIB sx-1's.

The gun is now cycling the super heavy shells and the link has not popped out again. Jeff
 
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