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Substitute Fiocchi 616 for Win 209 Primers?

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by Mike K P, Jan 1, 2010.

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  1. Mike K P

    Mike K P Member

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    Has anyone had any experience substituting Fiocchi 616 primers for Win 209? I was going to buy some Win 209 but have a bunch of the 616 to use up. Thanks, Mike.
     
  2. Hatshooter

    Hatshooter TS Member

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    hodgdon has several loads for fio 616 at their website.. I would think you would be allright using win primer forumlas providing they weren't max loads, a quick call to alliant would help if there was any doubt.
     
  3. Mike K P

    Mike K P Member

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    Thanks, Mike.
     
  4. Spanky

    Spanky Active Member

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    I've been using them more often (experimental less than 1000). I've gotten good reloads from them. I would try to obtain as much reloading info prior to use and not take for granted or assume that they are equal on all levels. I plan to buy 2000-3000 and try them for an extended period of time. Price is better but I'm a creature of habit and like the Winchester 209s.

    I've used them in reloads that I was trashing the hulls or letting them lay.

    I feel they are a good product but my use has been minimal at this time.
     
  5. mrskeet410

    mrskeet410 TS Member

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    Bad news and worse news.

    Bad news - Fiocchi are imported. Dollar is going throught the floor and will probably continue to do so. That means the price of all imports, including Fiocchi primers, will continue to go up. Soon Fiocchi may be the same price as Win 209s.

    Worse news - When the price of Fiocchis finally reached the price of Win 209s, Winchester may determine there are a bunch of guys that will always pay more for USA made Win 209s, so Winchester will skim that market by raising their prices to keep higher than Fiocchi....and that's all pure profit for Winchester.
     
  6. 22hornet

    22hornet Well-Known Member

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    I've used about 1000 616's in Rem hulls with DR-Xl-1 wads and 17.4 grs of Clays powder. They all go "bang". When I run out, I'll probably buy 5000 more.
     
  7. esoxhunter

    esoxhunter Well-Known Member

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    I have loaded 15000+ Fiocchi 616 primers and as of now have yet to have a misfire. At this time they give me the best "bang" for the $$. Spend your money the way you see fit; but I refuse to pay the prices that Winchester, Federal and Remington charge for a primer that does no more than the Fiocchi. The purpose of a primer is to ignite the powder charge. Why pay more for nothing ?? JMHO. Ed
     
  8. Spanky

    Spanky Active Member

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    Fiocchi raises their price........Winchester raises their price. Why doesn't Winchester lower their price and stop price gouging me and one million others. If they were at $28.00 - $29.00 per 1000 there wouldn't be an issue. That Browning or Beretta you're shooting was made over seas also. Get real your polititians wanted the global economy. The Repubs and Dems wanted it.
     
  9. Hatshooter

    Hatshooter TS Member

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    I've used 50k of the fio 616. great primers. good news from fio, the newer, hotter 617 will be in the USA sometime this year, they will be like a federal 209A
     
  10. FLIP

    FLIP Member

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    i use them alot, no misfires no problem with size, the only problem i have had with the fiocchis is they are hard on my firing pins,its a lot harder metal
     
  11. Barry C. Roach

    Barry C. Roach Well-Known Member

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    Do they make the primer hole larger and make the Winchesters fit too loosely?
     
  12. Quack Shot

    Quack Shot Active Member

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    The diameters are about the same, however, the taper is different. The forward end of the Fiocchi is larger than the forward end of the Winchester. They don't appear to enlarge the primer pockets enough to cause a loose fit for the Winchesters. The Winchester 209 has an odd profile with a "full diameter band" just forward of the rear flange.

    As far as a direct substitution, I would NOT recommend it. There is a bit of data out there for these primers. When in doubt, ask the powder or component manufacturers. I have had DISMAL results with some loads in cold weather using the Fiocchi 616. There is also a Fiocchi 615 which is larger than the standard 209 sized 616. They are rarely seen in the US anymore.

    I test my loads in cold conditions by placing a half a box in the freezer for a few days and keeping the other half at room temp. I chronograph both groups and see what the difference is. You'd be surprized at how bad some loads will perform. Sometimes it's a wad or a primer that seems to be at the root of the performace issue. It seems like the Fiocchi 616 is the root cause more often than not. I've tested a lot of factory stuff the same way. I have a lot of confidence in my "cold weather" loads. My Shotgun, rifle, and pistol loads are tested the same way.
     
  13. shot410ga

    shot410ga Well-Known Member

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    I've been using them for a couple of years. Maybe 25k. I've had no problems, and the price is right. Fact is no one knows where anything is made anymore, in most cases.
     
  14. halfmile

    halfmile Well-Known Member

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    I found the Fiocchis to misfire a lot when used in steel based hulls.

    Using a Citori and a 90T.

    Cheddites work much better.

    I prefer Remington but there are none around here.

    HM
     
  15. michmoe

    michmoe TS Member

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    Cheddites are made in France.Enough of a reason for me to not buy them.We saved their ass and they wouldn't even let us fly over their air space during desert storm.I've shot lots of Fiocchis for years with no problems.
     
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