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State Hall of fame and fairness

Discussion in 'Off Topic Threads' started by Twinbirds, Jun 10, 2013.

  1. Twinbirds

    Twinbirds TS Member

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    scores shouldn't be the only criteria, the positive influence over the sport should be another. Breaking hundreds doesn't get you there if nobody wants to be like you! and where you break your hundreds and how you break your hundreds. If it is a young man he might still have the best part of his career ahead. All in good time.
     
  2. grntitan

    grntitan Well-Known Member

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    Most all State and ATA Hall Of Fame inductees have proven themselves over many years of competition. In addition as Twinbirds pointed out they have also proven themselves as an overall asset to the sport over many years. Do you honestly believe some young shooter should be a Hall Of Fame inductee for a few years of great shooting?? Come on.....be real

    Perhaps the next Major League ball player to hit 25 homers in his rookie season should get an automatic Hall induction.
     
  3. 870

    870 Well-Known Member

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    I think you'll find that your state does have "rules' about HOF inductees. Very often, a shooter isn't even eligible until they have shot for the better part of a couple decades. Could this be an issue w/ the situation you are talking about?
     
  4. gr8shot

    gr8shot Member

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    what state copper?
     
  5. KennyRay

    KennyRay Active Member

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    State Hall's of Fame do have by-laws and guidelines for the selection of the most qualified shooters whose history is documented and validated.

    There will always be thoughts that one shooter should have been inducted before another but if the selection committees are being fair they will only select shooters who qualify with a written nomination, # of years in the sport, major state championship wins etc.

    Most states as well as the national Trapshooting Hall of Fame follow rules that permit people to be enshrined by three methods. 1. on shooting achievements; 2. for their life-long contributions to the sport; 3. a combination of #1 & #2.

    Some States also incorporated a waver to their 20, 25 or 30 years in the sport to permit young phenominal shooters who are deceased to be inducted if they had a certain number less than 20 years participation in the sport.

    It's not an easy job selecting inductees and not much help comes from the shooters regarding shooting history. Selection Committees usually do the research and verification themselves.

    Remember, if nobody submits a nomination for the person they think should be in their State THOF, that person will never be inducted. Help your State Selection Committees by completing and submitting a nomination form.

    Kenny Ray Estes
    Pittsgrove, NJ
     
  6. gr8shot

    gr8shot Member

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    what state copper? whats your boys name? lets look him up.
     
  7. Setterman

    Setterman Well-Known Member

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    Griz, You were in till they heard about the thong/beer tent incident.....
     
  8. grntitan

    grntitan Well-Known Member

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    I was on standby for shoot offs for the Grand American Handicap last year at the Grand. I shot a 95. Waited from 6:30 PM until 11:00 PM watching everyone else drinking beer while I sat nervous as hell when they finally told me all had been settled and I would not be needed. By then they were not selling beer anymore. Sooooo, maybe I should get a nod for the Hall??
     
  9. Joe Potosky

    Joe Potosky Well-Known Member

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    Yep, life's not fair sometimes....
     
  10. flashmax

    flashmax Well-Known Member

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    Well H.E. double stix copper. You have been asked a couple of times for the name and State of the guy you want in the State's HOF and you have NOT bothered to reply. Let's do some research and see if the guy deserved to be considered. If you don't care enough to give the name and state then;

    Looks to me like you just want to pi** and moan. Cut it out.

    Like the man said " Either Shi* or get off the pot. "

    Don T. ATA Life. Littleton CO
     
  11. gr8shot

    gr8shot Member

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    Name?

    Age?

    ATA #?

    State?

    Accomplishments?

    Contributions to the sport?

    We would love to back up your story, but we need more info. How bout it?
     
  12. Jerry Parr

    Jerry Parr Member

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    I am checking my Rosetta Stone inventory to decipher............LOL WTH???
     
  13. grntitan

    grntitan Well-Known Member

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    Seems to me copper, you are throwing a hissy fit like a damn little kid. You didn't get your way so now you are bad mouthing the whole system which you obviously know nothing about. So you nominated this shooter for a HOF induction but won't share his name here? How many State Teams did he make? That is accomplished by shooting and winning. So if he is as good as you say, he should be a perennial State Team member. Right??? Where all does this shooter compete?


    So did he know you nominated him? Does he think after just 20 years he is HOF material? There are shooters that have been shooting for many decades with impressive numbers that are not HOF members yet. You want to give your buddy a trip to the front of the line.
     
  14. gr8shot

    gr8shot Member

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    i think you're scared. i think you got caught runnin your chops.

    still waiting on the state you are from.

    if he was put in the hall of fame, we would know his name, so i'm sure he doesn't mind if you tell us now, especially being an accomplished shooter.

    is he a younger shooter, or has he been shooting for 20 years? i think you're diggin a hole.

    if you don't want to say, keep silent from the beginning. i'll be watching for you in future posts.
     
  15. gr8shot

    gr8shot Member

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    tick, tock, copperhead. lie there in the weeds silent, and without warning, strike at anything that comes by you don agree with.

    still waiting on that name and state.

    tick, tock. time's a waistin. we could move on if you spill your guts.
     
  16. wolfram

    wolfram Well-Known Member

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    Does a virtual hissy fit require literacy?

    Another consideration for HOF selection would be what the person has done for the game of trapshooting beyond showing up and shooting. It is not all about the average and there are many subjective considerations.
     
  17. W.P.T.

    W.P.T. TS Member

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    Suction, if that don't work more suction until they let you in ... The guidelines change from person to person unless you got good suction then you are a shoe in ... There are many who have earned their way in but then again there are those with good suction and a brown nose ... WPT ... (YAC) ...
     
  18. gr8shot

    gr8shot Member

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    N A M E ?

    S T A T E ?

    still waiting...........

    all you have to do is type a simple name and you can even abbreviate the state to save time.

    see, when you whine and moan without producing any facts, we don't believe you.

    right now, you have lost all credibility. from now on, when anyone sees your name, they will pass because you lack credit and integrity.

    it would be an honor for us to know what a wonderful shooter he is.
     
  19. gr8shot

    gr8shot Member

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    do this person a favor and never mention his name. coming from you, it will do more harm than good, someone who cant tell the truth, omission is just like a lie.

    and i do speak for all, all who want the truth, not just piss and moans.

    if his name is good enough to write in the hall of fame, forever etched, im sure its good enough to type here...... and the state.

    see, problem is, i dont believe you.

    im still waiting......on YOU to do what is right.
     
  20. KennyRay

    KennyRay Active Member

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    Copper:

    I want to believe that your State HOF Selection Committee or the member you spoke with really didn't know the person you nominated. This happens alot as members change, and some volunteer to help but really don't have a background in the history of the sport or know how to conduct the necessary research and verification.

    I would recommend that in addition to nominating your firend, provide the selection committee with all the accomplishments and contributions to the sport for your friend and help the committee learn and understand his/her qualifications. Then you know they have the information.

    The rules of every State HOF are not secret. Ask the committee for a copy of the qualifications / contributions they are using for considering nominees.

    I co-founded the New Jersey Trapshooting Hall of Fame in 1999 and I can assure you that nobody was considered for induction without us being in receipt of an official nomination form. I personally filled out one on George S. McCarty, second president of the ATA and provided his accomplishments and contributions to all committee members for their review.

    I often heard complaints of "Why hasn't the Committee inducted "this shooter?" Most of the time nobody took time to submit a nomination on the shooter. I was told I should be embarrassed that "this shooter" has not been inducted yet. The shooter being talked about was a friend of mine who had declined several times, my request to sit down with him and help me document his shooting achievements. He felt, as many people being nominated do, that there are many others who should be inducted before he was given consideration. But Selection Committee Members only have so much time to conduct so much research. I finally was able to gather enough information on my friends shooting career (with his help) and he was inducted in the NJ Trapshooting HOF a few years ago. I was honored that he asked me to be his presenter.

    Many folks wonder why "a shooter" has not been inducted into the national Trapshooting Hall of Fame. Often times their name has never been submitted to the Selection Committee even though the shooter has a marvelous record over many years (many State HOF's require 20 years). I've been working on several old-time long since passed shooters who I'm sure the THOF Selection Committee has never heard of but in my view, they deserve a fair review. Several years ago, I submitted George Maxwell, the one-armed shooter from Hastings, Nebraska, born 1866 and died in 1936. Nobody ever heard of him. He was so good that U.M.C. Remington hired him as a professional shooter. He shot as a member of a touring team with Annie Oakley. In 1908 & 1911 he broke more targets at the Grand American than any other shooter winning the High General Average (today called High Over-All). He was a good doubles shooter also, winning the Nebraska State Doubles in 1910 and topped all the professionals in 1911. He was selected for induction in 2006 and I was honored with the opportunity to present him.

    If you really think your friend is deserving of enshrinement, sit down with them, record their shooting history and contributions, and submit a complete package to your Selection Committee. They will thank you and you will be moving in a positive direction on behalf of your shooting friend.

    Best of luck,

    Kenny Ray Estes