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Sportsmanship

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by trinketshooter, Nov 29, 2009.

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  1. trinketshooter

    trinketshooter TS Member

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    On the topic of sportsmanship, how far should a shooter let the management of a shoot go? In all of our shooting sports, we pay alot of money to enter these shoots, most often significantly more than the awards that we receive for winning these events. We also spend a significant amount of money in shells and practice rounds to prepare for these compitions. Is it unsportsmanlike to expect to receive the awards we win at these expensive shoots? What is to be expected of us when a group of people running a shoot do not follow the shoot program, but instead decide to change the rules after the shoot is done? Do we just let it slide and let them do what ever they want? I do understand that it is a nice concept to want to spread the awards out so some of the newer shooters can win, but maybe we should clarify this intention before the shoot starts. I guess that my father taught me that right is right and wrong is wrong and there is no in between. He also taught me to never, ever, let someone take advantage of you. I have had an experience earlier this year that I thought had been worked out. I am not used to having someone try to take advantage of me so maybe I didn't handle the situation as well as I should have or would handle it if the situation would arise again. There has been a little tension but I was under the impression that we were all satisfied and would not discuss it further, but I guess that I was naive in believing that all was well. Several people went to our most important shoot of the year and apparently did some talking amongst themselves. All of a sudden, ten months later, a certain individual not even involved in any way doesn't want to shoot with me any more. I can honestly say that I would be pleased to shoot with any of these individuals at any time. We may not be good friends but I do respect them all as individuals. Should I just let someone walk all over me the next time in the name of sportsmanship to avoid problems like this? Pease tell me your thoughts on this subject. Neil Swenson
     
  2. halfmile

    halfmile Well-Known Member

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    I agree, but i have to add the following:

    Any club that would have a printed program and then change the terms when the shoot was done, would never see me again.

    I have been on the management side of this, and the rule here was you did what the program said no matter what.

    Sometimes clubs get reputations, and their bottom line suffers because of it.

    HM
     
  3. samiam03

    samiam03 Member

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    If your entry was accepted and you participated by the stated rules then you had a contract.

    Sam
     
  4. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

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    In racing we used to call that "being handled by the locals", meaning they made sure the local boys would win by arbitrarily changing or "reinterpreting" the rules and other criteria.
     
  5. trinketshooter

    trinketshooter TS Member

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    How the awards were to be awarded was spelled out word for word in the program. It was really my first high placing win and I was very happy and excited. Based on what the program said, me and many other experienced shooters knew exactly who had won what awards at the end of the shoot. I was lucky enough to win the HOA award and had the highest score for one of the gun champ awards. When the folks running the shoot were putting the names down for the awards, they gave my name for the HOA and also the gun champ for the one gauge award. Immediately, the club manager told the experienced person at the computer that I was ineligible for the award because I had won the HOA, which neither I nor anyone else had ever seen before. A person is generally excluded from the class awards when winning the HOA, which is fair and understandable. The person that wins HOA usually does win one or more gun champ awards. Later I was told that they only wanted to give one award per person but the program did not indicate this. Apparently they didn't remember that they had given two awards to another shooter. He had received an award for gun champ and a class award. I was a little put off by this. That night, I called several knowledgeable people about this to ask their advice on what I should do. We are kind of a close knit group and word got bck to the shoot management quickly that I was asking questions. It kind went over like a fart in church. On the advice of all the people that I talked to, I decided to try to talk to The shoot management about this. One of the individuals treated me very badly in front of one of his employees, I beleive, trying to provoke a response from me, which didn't work. They kind of ganged up on me when I had a meeting with the whole group. I wasn't getting anywhere so I had to bring the national organization in on the problem, as it was a sanctioned event. I didn't want to get them involved but I had exhausted every local option. The national rep solved the problem rapidly. I have heard that some of the individuals of the management that was involved are saying behind my back that I am a whiner because I stood up for myself, but I felt like I was backed into a corner. I think that both I and the shoot management could have done a better job resolving this issue but it is what it is.
     
  6. Neil Winston

    Neil Winston Well-Known Member

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    Talk to the individual who won't shoot with you and tell him your side of the story. If he still won't shoot with you just kiss it off and shoot with someone else. He or she can't be only person at the club. I'll shoot with anybody but it's no big deal of someone declines; what's it to me, after all? There are 30,000 ATA shooters and I'm sure to find one who doesn't snub me. Life really is too short to stew about things like this as you apparently have for months; as they used to say in the 60's "Why travel heavy when you can travel light?"


    Neil
     
  7. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

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    Don't worry about it. Standing up for yourself or others then being accused of being a whiner is apparently normal for trapshooting.
     
  8. BIGDON

    BIGDON Well-Known Member

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    Brian if you dislike trapshooters so much why do you hang around here??

    Don
     
  9. phirel

    phirel TS Member

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    At a trap shoot, the situation would not arise. It is true that a person can win only one trophy per event, but HOA and HAA are listed as separate events. When trinketshooter stated that he won one of the gun champion awards, I concluded that he was at a skeet shoot. I do not know the rules that govern skeet.

    Pat Ireland
     
  10. eightbore

    eightbore Well-Known Member

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    At a skeet shoot, if you win you win. Only exception is that the gun champion usually comes out of class. The gun champion is usually guaranteed more money than the class winner. The HOA champion can also win every gun championship because all the shootoffs are separate. Why attend the shootoff if you can't win?
     
  11. hmb

    hmb Well-Known Member

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    At most shoots even when you win you lose if you add up all of your expenses. I guess we compete because of our love for the sport and not for the money. HMB
     
  12. Tron

    Tron Supporting Vendor Supporting Vendor

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    I beat a guy in an ATA shoot off once and he wouldn't shake my little Troll hand afterwords....true story. We still laugh about it.
     
  13. jim brown

    jim brown Well-Known Member

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    Sounds like a skeet deal to me.

    jim brown
     
  14. AlanM

    AlanM Member

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    Sounds like a case of poor sportsmanship. If that is the way that club operates, that would be the last time they saw any of my money.

    Alan
     
  15. Tron

    Tron Supporting Vendor Supporting Vendor

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    Yo...Jimmy B. Whatever happened with that 1000 yard shooting bet you had with that dude in Montana? I've always wondered about that.

    Nice to see you back.
     
  16. trinketshooter

    trinketshooter TS Member

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    Pat's right, it was a skeet shoot. And I have talked to the individual that didn't want to shoot with me. It has been a couple of weeks since we spoke. I guess I'll find out soon enough if it had any positive effect or not. I still shoot with absolutely anyone and definitely have no ill feelings for the people that were actually involved. And I agree with you, HMB, we definitely don't do this for the money. I do it because I consider it to be a great personal challenge and the majority of the other shooters, whether they shoot registered or just for fun, are a pleasure to be around.
     
  17. jim brown

    jim brown Well-Known Member

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    Tron,

    Don't really remember. Guess it just died the quiet death it deserved.

    jim brown
     
  18. Tron

    Tron Supporting Vendor Supporting Vendor

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    Oh Bull$hit Jimmy....how could you forget. It was a bet that you had with some cattle rancher where he claimed that he could hit a 9" paper plate (or something along those lines) at some sort of consistant basis with his .50BMG or something like that. I may have stirred the pot a little bit, but I can't remember that part. It was a long time ago.

    OH! Now I even remember his handle....it was "$andbagger". Yep, pretty sure.
     
  19. jim brown

    jim brown Well-Known Member

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    Tron,

    I forgot because I'm old. As I remember I sent him a dime that shot at 500 yards with my 30-30 and he gave up. At least that's my story and I'm sticking with it.

    jim brown
     
  20. Shooting Coach

    Shooting Coach Well-Known Member

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    Don't forget the four magic words.

    VOTE WITH YOUR POCKETBOOK.
     
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