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Son's gun is shooting to the left?

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by LarryBud, Apr 14, 2013.

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  1. LarryBud

    LarryBud TS Supporters TS Supporters

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    My son has a Citori XT non-adjustable comb and butt plate. We have patterned it 10 times and used software to analyze the patterns. On average, the gun shoots to the left of POA by 2 inches. I don't want to add an adjustable comb in the middle of the season. He has shot as high as 95 and averages 90 in singles. Is it worth messing with? Looking for quick fix. Any ideas?

    Larry
     
  2. Avaldes

    Avaldes Well-Known Member

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    Perhaps a choke tube from Briley to move the pattern over? Don't handicap your son now as he will develop bad habits that will be hard to break later.
     
  3. Dr.Longshot

    Dr.Longshot Banned Banned

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    What is his sight picture/ have him close his eyes mount the gun and you look over the bbl and see where his eye alignment is. Is his eye directly over the beads?

    If not he needs an adj, comb.


    Gary Bryant
    Dr.longshot
     
  4. Avaldes

    Avaldes Well-Known Member

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    Gary brought up a good point. I interpreted your post as saying the gun shot crooked to the left. Or is it that your son is not able to get straight into the gun?

    The first can be fixed with a special choke tube. The second requires an adjustable comb.
     
  5. bevolt

    bevolt Member

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    Did you do an off-hand pattern test or a bench test? At what distance did you pattern? For example, Beretta factory specification for point of impact at 35 yds is anywhere within a circle of radius 3" centered 3" above the point of aim. When I bench patterned my 391 last summer, the POI was about 1.5" from the POA at 25 yds, which is within factory spec.
     
  6. ysr_racer

    ysr_racer Active Member

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    Aim 2 inches to the right?
     
  7. BigBadBob

    BigBadBob TS Member

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    Dr. Longshot is correct, although you may be able to get away with a neoprene , self-stick pad on the stock. Do as he says with closing his eyes and mounting the gun. (empty of course). Assuming he is right -handed, if the beads line up towards his nose a pad on left side of stock will push his eye towards the rib as his cheek will be pushed away from the stock by the pad. Just the opposite if he is left-handed.

    My son had same problem and as I contemplated several hundred dollars of stock work, a $20 neoprene pad of 1/4" thickness did the trick.

    His average went from high 80's to mid 90's very quickly.
     
  8. j2jake

    j2jake Well-Known Member

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    Come on guys, first rule of thumb is "Gun Fit Gun Fit...". He , the son is being handicaped by a gun that does not fit properly. Dad, FIX IT. Should it have an adjustable comb, and the pattern is to the left of center,it, the comb, should be moved to the right. Pattern board will prove me correct. Jake
     
  9. LarryBud

    LarryBud TS Supporters TS Supporters

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    We patterned the gun at 27 yards. He uses Diana choke tubes Improved Mod.

    Every time I have looked down the barrel, it looks like his eyes are lined up well. He has had this checked by a professional as well and have been told it was a good fit.

    I thought about a neoprem pad as well, but that would move comb away from his face making the shot more to the left. I am correct?

    Will an adjustable butt plat help? Reason, I would lean this way is maybe I can get this done in less than a week. He has regional tournament in less than 1 month, and we cannot afford to put the gun in a shop for a couple of weeks.

    I live in central Arkansas. Would be open to suggestions.
     
  10. W.P.T.

    W.P.T. TS Member

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    Have you tried to shoot it to make sure its the gun and not your son ..? If he is canting the gun that might be his problem ... Have Tron do an adjustable comb, he does a quick turn around from what people say about him ... WPT ... (YAC) ...
     
  11. Unknown1

    Unknown1 Well-Known Member

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    <blockquote><I>"Every time I have looked down the barrel, it looks like his eyes are lined up well."</I></blockquote>Maybe so...but what is happening the instant before he pulls the trigger and in anticipation of the recoil? Might he be forcing his cheek into the stock? Is he anxious about the recoil and possibly relaxing just a bit to reduce the effects of it just before he fires?

    Keller
     
  12. ImpalaBob

    ImpalaBob Member

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    Buy a roll of moleskin from your pharmacy. It is adhesive backed and can be applied to the comb in layers for adjustments. Next .... an adjustable comb.
     
  13. Dr.Longshot

    Dr.Longshot Banned Banned

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    The stock does not have enough cast off for a Right Hand shooter or it may have a bad choke tube, try another tube on pattern board first.

    A very slight eye alignment is probably the problem, he must get an adjustable conmb, or practice mounting the gun w/eyes closed and then opening them for correct bead alignment, the beads must be aligned every time, try it 10-15 times in a mirror.

    I personally think an adjustable comb isa the answer about $100-$150 expense.

    Try Tron or Dave Berlet in Ohio plus many others.

    Gary Bryant
    Dr,longshot
     
  14. hmb

    hmb Well-Known Member

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    At a distance of 972 jnches the gun is off 2 inches. Forget about the 2 inches for now and let him get as much practice in as possible before the big shoot. HMB
     
  15. Neil Winston

    Neil Winston Well-Known Member

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    I do have one question, Larry. Are _all_ the shots two inches left? Really? All of them?
    That would indicate a level of skill in long-distance patterning that is so rare I can hardly credit it. In fact, I have serious doubts whether a 2-inch deviation can be reliably detected at 27 yards at all. Even if it could, it's effect on singles shooting with an IM choke is even more doubtful.

    (When you say you did the testing at 27 yards, do you mean a measured 27 yards from muzzle to target? Were you using a rest or shooting free-hand? )

    To give you good advice, we really need so see what you are seeing (on your data sheets.) Could you just list the results, like: "1 inch left, 2 inches left, 3 inches left, center?" When we see what's happening maybe we can tell you if we think you really have a problem or are just shooting a shotgun which - like all shotguns - does not always shoot where pointed but makes a "pattern" of points of impact.

    If we think there is problem, the first thing to do is find out if we are right; find out if it shoots straight. There's only one way. It's at the link above. Plan to part of a day doing it. If it does not, in fact, shot straight (and you will know after shooting most of a box of shells, both of you trying it), read the advice in the booklet. If it does shoot OK, quit worrying. (If I was getting 2 inches at 27 yards, I'd likely not be much concerned. If it were free-hand, I'd think I really had no idea where the gun shot anyway. The last thing I would do is take steps to "fix" it without first trying to determine whether I actually had a problem. After all, if you are flying blind, you are as likely to make things worse as better.)

    By the way, congratulations on trying to find out at all. You are a rare coach; my guess is a good one. I think it's fine you checked, but I wonder if you have enough experience testing points-of-impact to recognize the difference between a problem and unrealistic expectations.

    Neil
     
  16. JACK

    JACK Well-Known Member Supporting Vendor

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    I look for patterns that "feel" right at the time the gun goes off. I pull left with a release about 50% of the time. Unknown one is onto something to consider. Your son's finger position on the trigger blade can alter the shot slightly. These are 13 yard patterns.
    mia_2008_0303610.jpg
     
  17. Sky Buster

    Sky Buster Sky Buster TS Supporters

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    Use a wood workers rasp and remove wood from the left side
    of the stock. When the patterns are centered, sand and refinish
    the wood. I've done it several times. It's not that difficult.
    If you can't do the refinish, take it to a gunsmith.
     
  18. Neil Winston

    Neil Winston Well-Known Member

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    sky buster, when you gave the rasp advice, did you take into consideration that Larry has said his son seems to be straight down the rib now and we don't really know enough about his testing setup to be sure he has a problem at all? And if he does it, the shooter will not be looking straight down the gun anymore? And the fact that rasping is a permanent "cure" to a problem (if any) which may be caused by something entirely different?

    Neil
     
  19. bevolt

    bevolt Member

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    I would second Neil's comment that 2" at 27 yds is a pretty small error, especially for an offhand shot. At that level of precision, it starts to become difficult to separate random error from systematic error. The standard deviation in the POI of my patterns shot from a shooting bench was 2" at 25 yds. If you are using "shotgun insight" to calculate the POI, I would suggest repeating the experiment to see if you can reproduce the results. Also, were the wind conditions dead calm when you did the pattern testing? It only takes a slight cross wind (~5-7mph) to cause 8 shot to drift 2" at 27 yds.
     
  20. magnumshot

    magnumshot Active Member

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    I had a Beretta barrel fitted with eccentric thin walled choke tubes. It was a good five inches left with five shots at 30 yards from a rest and offhand. Originally it was a fixed full choke, but had been opened up wide with a rat tail file or something at some point. It shot a real nice pattern, but always bothered me for handicap. Now I have options for different chokes and it's dead on left to right. This barrel also shoots 90/10, and that's what I like. Wish I could find an O/U barrel to match. I would just leave well enough alone if he's shooting well. 2" is not much.
     
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